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Home > Archive > Xbox forum > September 2005 > DirectX 10 + WGF2.0 will ship with Windows VISTA
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DirectX 10 + WGF2.0 will ship with Windows VISTA
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| http://www.extremetech.com/article2...,1841223,00.asp
_______________________
DirectX 10
With all the talk of next-generation consoles-and some very impressive
screenshots floating around the web-fans of PC games are naturally wondering
whether these powerful new systems are going to "kill" PC games. In a word .
.. . no.
The upcoming Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 are based on DirectX 9 technology,
in the case of the 360 it's "DirectX 9 and then a little more." But DirectX
10 is a whole different animal. It's a major revision to the API, almost a
complete rewrite that requires substantially different hardware than the
stuff we've seen so far.
To start with, let's clear up a few naming misconceptions. Over the past
year or more, the graphics "stuff" coming in Windows Vista has been referred
to by many names. DirectX Next and Windows Graphics Foundation 2.0 are two
of the most prominent. The names have been changing internally at Microsoft,
and it seems that they've all but settled on actually calling it DirectX 10.
Contrary to some reports, it will ship with Vista, along with DirectX 9.L, a
version of DX9 altered to fit the new LDDM driver model used by the OS.
DirectX 10 started by fixing what was broken in the previous APIs, like some
stability problems and small batch performance, and then removing old
unnecessary parts of the API (like the fixed function transform and lighting
calls). This served as the foundation for a graphics API that could
radically change the way games look and really take PCs to that next quantum
leap, even over next-generation consoles.
The new graphics API will have much more stringent requirements for graphics
cards, with a very particular guaranteed feature set. There should be no
more "cap bits" needed to determine if your graphics cards can perform
certain functions. The behavior of DX10 cards will be strictly defined, so
developers can get the expected output from their code with no tweaking
necessary for the eccentricities of different graphics cards from different
vendors.
It also requires several new features of the hardware. The first is a new
"geometry shader" function, which operates not on single vertices like
today's vertex shader units, but on entire primitives: dots, lines, lines
with adjacent vertices, triangles, and triangles with adjacent vertices. The
huge performance penalty imposed by too many state changes should be a thing
of the past as well. Render states are grouped into five different objects
that can be cached by the hardware, with up to 4096 state objects of each
type cacheable at once. DX10 also introduces a common shader core between
pixels and vertices. Granted, this does not mean that the hardware itself
needs to have ALUs that operate on either pixels or vertices, just that the
language and functions have been fused into a single shader set.
The net result of these things should be games with an absolutely
unprecedented level of detail, including a dramatic increase in "clutter,"
or the hordes of random and different stuff that exists in the real world
but not in games. Obviously, rendering quality will shoot way up, too, with
improved masking functions for antialiasing. It will also mean better object
sorting, the ability to algorithmically generate content entirely on the
GPU, and ultimately memory virtualization in the LDDM driver model to reduce
bandwidth costs and provide more granular access to graphics data.
Right now, it's all a bit too much to take in. Some of the specs are still
in flux, and you need an unabridged programmer-to-English dictionary to even
comprehend the scope of the changes and their ramifications. Suffice it to
say: When DirectX 10 games hit us, they're going to be of a quality that
next-gen consoles can't touch.
________________________________________________
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| Highlandish 2005-07-29, 12:32 am |
| Quoth The Raven "Highlander"<Highlander> in
GdydnTN8ptCI-nTfRVn-oA@comcast.com
quote:
> Right now, it's all a bit too much to take in. Some of the specs are
> still in flux, and you need an unabridged programmer-to-English
> dictionary to even comprehend the scope of the changes and their
> ramifications. Suffice it to say: When DirectX 10 games hit us,
> they're going to be of a quality that next-gen consoles can't touch.
>
> ________________________________________________
will dx10 be available to those whose OS does not meet the "genuine ms
advantage" through validation?
--
2 rules to success in life. 1. Don't tell people everything you know.
Take out the _CURSEING to reply to me
| |
| First of One 2005-07-29, 12:32 am |
| Of course, there's no reason to download DX10. Any game that requires it
will have a redistributable version on the game disc.
--
"War is the continuation of politics by other means.
It can therefore be said that politics is war without
bloodshed while war is politics with bloodshed."
"Highlandish" <ckreskay_CURSEING@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:42e98716$0$18643$14726298@news.sunsite.dk...
quote:
> will dx10 be available to those whose OS does not meet the "genuine ms
> advantage" through validation?
>
> --
> 2 rules to success in life. 1. Don't tell people everything you know.
>
> Take out the _CURSEING to reply to me
>
| |
| grolschie 2005-07-29, 3:33 am |
|
"First of One" <daxinfx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:rtudnfWUUMB9E3TfRVn-sA@rogers.com...
quote:
> Of course, there's no reason to download DX10. Any game that requires it
> will have a redistributable version on the game disc.
So there won't be any open source DirectX10 games then, eh?
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"Highlandish" <ckreskay_CURSEING@dodo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:42e98716$0$18643$14726298@news.sunsite.dk...
quote:
> Quoth The Raven "Highlander"<Highlander> in
> GdydnTN8ptCI-nTfRVn-oA@comcast.com
>
> will dx10 be available to those whose OS does not meet the "genuine ms
> advantage" through validation?
>
> --
quote:
> We can download dx10 from various websites and idd,from the games
themselfes.
I have the same with highmat,i never used it,until my new videocard required
it.
When installing the drivers this came along with it...
| |
| NoRemorse 2005-07-29, 7:01 am |
|
"grolschie" <grolschie@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote in message
news:tNiGe.4403$PL5.397381@news.xtra.co.nz...
quote:
>
> "First of One" <daxinfx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:rtudnfWUUMB9E3TfRVn-sA@rogers.com...
>
> So there won't be any open source DirectX10 games then, eh?
Why not? It's the same with DX9 and all the versions before that. The DX
specs are public, so programmers can take advantage of all the DX functions.
If those programmers want to make their source code public, power to them.
--
NoRemorse
"Expect me when you see me."
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| grolschie 2005-07-30, 12:31 am |
|
"NoRemorse" <thebummer@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:YPSdnThRT9a1QnTfRVn-ig@comcast.com...
quote:
>
> "grolschie" <grolschie@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote in message
> news:tNiGe.4403$PL5.397381@news.xtra.co.nz...
>
> Why not? It's the same with DX9 and all the versions before that. The
> DX specs are public, so programmers can take advantage of all the DX
> functions. If those programmers want to make their source code public,
> power to them.
I was being sarcastic to the guy who said there'd be no reason to
download DX10. Open Source games will be one reason to download it as
most OSS games are downloaded.
grol
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| First of One 2005-07-30, 3:32 am |
| Open source games? How many decent ones were released last year?
The point is, every retail game that requires DX10 will have it on its
CD/DVD. Even if you encounter the odd open source game, a copy of DX10
redistributable will always be close by.
--
"War is the continuation of politics by other means.
It can therefore be said that politics is war without
bloodshed while war is politics with bloodshed."
"grolschie" <grolschie@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote in message
news:tNiGe.4403$PL5.397381@news.xtra.co.nz...
quote:
> So there won't be any open source DirectX10 games then, eh?
>
| |
| Beowulf 2005-08-01, 8:36 pm |
| Highlander wrote:
quote:
> http://www.extremetech.com/article2...,1841223,00.asp
>
> _______________________
> DirectX 10
> With all the talk of next-generation consoles-and some very impressive
> screenshots floating around the web-fans of PC games are naturally wondering
> whether these powerful new systems are going to "kill" PC games. In a word .
> . . no.
>
blah blah blah
I said it before, I'll say it now, and I'll say it in the future:
dx always has and always will suck.
You can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear, as they say. You want
stability, driver independence, speed, and cross platform capability?
Go OPENGL
I avoid dx games like the plague and give my sparse $$ to those who
develop using the OPENGL API. It just works.
| |
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| So, you are happy playing games such as PONG on your computer?? Direct X is
a good system, and insures that games run on all hardware.
"Beowulf" <edkchem@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:11esgcg2b9esn68@corp.supernews.com...
quote:
> Highlander wrote:
> blah blah blah
>
> I said it before, I'll say it now, and I'll say it in the future:
>
> dx always has and always will suck.
>
> You can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear, as they say. You want
> stability, driver independence, speed, and cross platform capability? Go
> OPENGL
>
> I avoid dx games like the plague and give my sparse $$ to those who
> develop using the OPENGL API. It just works.
| |
|
| That's rather patrionising,wouldn't you say?
I believe it's about time directx really makes a difference in the game
speed.
And as for games like pong?Check this opengl link...
http://home.pacbell.net/freundj/openglgames/
"guess" <imnot@home.com> schreef in bericht
news:1122915772.242186@news.westman.wave.ca...
quote:
> So, you are happy playing games such as PONG on your computer?? Direct X
is
quote:
> a good system, and insures that games run on all hardware.
>
>
> "Beowulf" <edkchem@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:11esgcg2b9esn68@corp.supernews.com...
>
>
| |
| grolschie 2005-08-01, 8:36 pm |
|
"guess" <imnot@home.com> wrote in message
news:1122915772.242186@news.westman.wave.ca...
quote:
> So, you are happy playing games such as PONG on your computer??
> Direct X is a good system, and insures that games run on all hardware.
Ever hear of OpenGL?
| |
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| I think that windows is a bit selfish with its DX
"grolschie" <grolschie@NOSPAMgmail.com> wrote in message
news:bJwHe.5078$PL5.463476@news.xtra.co.nz...
quote:
>
> "guess" <imnot@home.com> wrote in message
> news:1122915772.242186@news.westman.wave.ca...
>
> Ever hear of OpenGL?
>
| |
| Praxiteles Democritus 2005-08-30, 8:35 pm |
| On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 22:42:06 +0200, "Flow" <Flowing@zonnet.nl> wrote:
quote:
>That's rather patrionising,wouldn't you say?
>I believe it's about time directx really makes a difference in the game
>speed.
>And as for games like pong?Check this opengl link...
>http://home.pacbell.net/freundj/openglgames/
Wow! Long list of games - NOT!
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| On Thu, 28 Jul 2005 18:15:33 -0500, <Highlander> wrote:
quote:
>http://www.extremetech.com/article2...,1841223,00.asp
>
>_______________________
>DirectX 10
>With all the talk of next-generation consoles-and some very impressive
>screenshots floating around the web-fans of PC games are naturally wondering
>whether these powerful new systems are going to "kill" PC games. In a word .
>. . no.
And Totally Incompatible with DX7, 8 and (9
No Backswords compatible..
Has to use some kind of Emulation mode so runs a lot slower..
Why do we have to put up with this Crap..
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