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Fischer's press conference -- Iceland must be so proud
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| The Masked Bishop 2005-03-25, 5:51 pm |
| Bobby's back in style, now standing on Icelandic soil, flanked by his new
hosts who are still flush with the emotion of flash celebrity that comes to
people who don't often get recognized for anything.
And what does he have to say? Oh, the usual: the USA is evil, chess sucks,
and the Jews are out to get him. Standard boiler-plate Fischer, the usual
paranoid rantings of someone with clear mental problems.
Had any of you friends or loved ones who acted like this, you'd get them
help. But Fischer doesn't get help--he gets a citizenship, from the good
taxpayers of Iceland, who now have made the world news for the first time
since...1972?
They must be so proud.
| |
| Paul Rubin 2005-03-25, 5:51 pm |
| "The Masked Bishop" <tmb@chesscave.com> writes:
quote:
> Had any of you friends or loved ones who acted like this, you'd get them
> help.
How would you do that, if they didn't want the type of help you had
in mind for them? The best you could probably do, if that person was
stuck in some oppressive and hostile environment (such as being locked
up at Narita Airport for 9 months), would be try to get them away to
someplace more supportive.
quote:
> But Fischer doesn't get help--he gets a citizenship,
As we've seen, getting the citizenship was of tremendous help in
getting Fischer out of captivity.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-25, 9:52 pm |
| > And what does he have to say? Oh, the usual: the USA is evil, chess sucks,
quote:
> and the Jews are out to get him. Standard boiler-plate Fischer, the usual
> paranoid rantings of someone with clear mental problems.
And a game 1,000 times stronger than his critics could ever hope to achieve.
quote:
> Had any of you friends or loved ones who acted like this, you'd get them
> help. But Fischer doesn't get help--he gets a citizenship, from the good
> taxpayers of Iceland, who now have made the world news for the first time
> since...1972?
Fischer's views may be extreme, but no more extreme than say those of Steve
Carlton, still much loved in Philadelphia despite their disagreement with
him.
Real chess fans are into chess, not amateur psychology.
quote:
> They must be so proud.
I bet they are. They are mature enough to tolerate someone they disagree
with vehemently.
They also seem to have a much better memory of 1972 than the Republican
party here, which sucked his dick for a month in public to beg him to play
the match.
Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to care
about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and they were
equally colorful.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| parrthenon@cs.com 2005-03-25, 9:52 pm |
| NOW IT CAN BE TOLD
<Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
care about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and
they were equally colorful.> Ray Gordon
True. As long as chess is played, Fischer's masterpieces will
remain immortal. "Pay attention to Fischer's games, not his opinions,"
wrote GM Evans in Chess Life, March 2005.
Working quietly behind the scenes Boris Spassky, Larry Evans, Don
Schultz and other noted chessers helped persuade Iceland to grant
Fischer asylum. Every little bit helped.
As I noted earlier, "Bobby deserves his freedom not because he's a
decent human being but because he's not a criminal. In that sense,
his fight is our fight. But only in that sense."
| |
| parrthenon@cs.com 2005-03-25, 9:52 pm |
| NOW IT CAN BE TOLD
<Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
care about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and
they were equally colorful.> Ray Gordon
True. As long as chess is played, Fischer's masterpieces will
remain immortal. "Pay attention to Fischer's games, not his opinions,"
wrote GM Evans in Chess Life, March 2005.
Working quietly behind the scenes Boris Spassky, Larry Evans, Don
Schultz and other noted chessers helped persuade Iceland to grant
Fischer asylum. Every little bit helped.
As I noted earlier, "Bobby deserves his freedom not because he's a
decent human being but because he's not a criminal. In that sense,
his fight is our fight. But only in that sense."
| |
| R.P. Warren 2005-03-25, 9:52 pm |
|
Ray Gordon wrote:
quote:
> Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
care
quote:
> about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and they
were
quote:
> equally colorful.
Mr. Gordon has an odd definition of 'colorful', and shows great
ignorance of chess history. No world champion has ever come close to
Fischer for utter offensiveness. Even Alekhine's 'Jewish and Aryan
Chess' articles are mild by comparison with what Fischer has said.
It's been nearly 60 years since Alekhine died, and his articles are
still very well remembered. I doubt that Fischer's much more
inflammatory statements will be forgotten a century from now.
| |
| Ken Albin 2005-03-25, 9:52 pm |
|
Ray Gordon wrote:
quote:
> And a game 1,000 times stronger than his critics could ever hope to
achieve.
I don't recall Bobby playing ANY games in the past 13 years.
Ken Albin
| |
| Doom & Gloom Dave 2005-03-26, 3:50 am |
| parrthenon@cs.com wrote:
quote:
> NOW IT CAN BE TOLD
>
> <Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
> care about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and
> they were equally colorful.> Ray Gordon
>
Yes, and today nobody remembers Wagner's anti-semitism right? <snort>
quote:
> True. As long as chess is played, Fischer's masterpieces will
> remain immortal. "Pay attention to Fischer's games, not his opinions,"
> wrote GM Evans in Chess Life, March 2005.
>
> Working quietly behind the scenes Boris Spassky, Larry Evans, Don
> Schultz and other noted chessers helped persuade Iceland to grant
> Fischer asylum. Every little bit helped.
>
Shame on them all. Particularly Schultz, the USCF doesn't need leaders who
aid and abet criminals.
quote:
> As I noted earlier, "Bobby deserves his freedom not because he's a
> decent human being but because he's not a criminal. In that sense,
> his fight is our fight. But only in that sense."
Yes, actually he is.
| |
| Adrian MacNair 2005-03-26, 6:51 am |
| "The Masked Bishop" <tmb@chesscave.com> wrote in message
news:AA%0e.14368$DW.11150@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
quote:
> Had any of you friends or loved ones who acted like this, you'd get them
> help. But Fischer doesn't get help--he gets a citizenship, from the good
> taxpayers of Iceland, who now have made the world news for the first time
> since...1972?
No, their ideas for geothermal power are well documented in the media.
Unfortunately they don't seem to realize that the rest of us don't have
volcanic hot springs under our houses.
| |
| sigvald@binet.is 2005-03-26, 6:51 am |
|
Adrian MacNair wrote:
quote:
> "The Masked Bishop" <tmb@chesscave.com> wrote in message
> news:AA%0e.14368$DW.11150@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
them[vbcol=seagreen]
good[vbcol=seagreen]
first time[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> No, their ideas for geothermal power are well documented in the
media.
quote:
> Unfortunately they don't seem to realize that the rest of us don't
have
quote:
> volcanic hot springs under our houses.
Neither do we, no one in Iceland has hot springs under our houses, most
of the water used for heating comes from sources 20 - 100 kms away.
| |
| parrthenon@cs.com 2005-03-26, 5:53 pm |
| <Working quietly behind the scenes Boris Spassky, Larry Evans, Don
Schultz and other noted chessers helped persuade Iceland to grant
Fischer asylum. Every little bit helped.> Larry Parr
<Shame on them all. Particularly Schultz, the USCF doesn't need leaders
who aid and abet criminals.> Anonymouse
quote:
> As I noted earlier, "Bobby deserves his freedom not because he's a
decent human being but because he's not a criminal. In that sense, his
fight is our fight. But only in that sense."> Larry Parr
< Yes, actually he is.> -- Anonymouse
Really. What was Bobby Fischer convicted of?
Contrary to Doom & Gloom Dave, I think it's laudable that people
who Bobby trashed on his website nevertheless worked for his release as
a matter of principle.
| |
| Doom & Gloom Dave 2005-03-26, 5:53 pm |
| parrthenon@cs.com wrote:
quote:
> <Working quietly behind the scenes Boris Spassky, Larry Evans, Don
> Schultz and other noted chessers helped persuade Iceland to grant
> Fischer asylum. Every little bit helped.> Larry Parr
>
> <Shame on them all. Particularly Schultz, the USCF doesn't need
> leaders who aid and abet criminals.> Anonymouse
>
> decent human being but because he's not a criminal. In that sense,
> his fight is our fight. But only in that sense."> Larry Parr
>
> < Yes, actually he is.> -- Anonymouse
>
> Really. What was Bobby Fischer convicted of?
>
> Contrary to Doom & Gloom Dave, I think it's laudable that people
> who Bobby trashed on his website nevertheless worked for his release
> as a matter of principle.
You really need to learn how to use a newsreader properly, and reply to
the message you are responding to.
Bobby is guilty of both not paying taxes, and defying the executive order.
He has proudly admitted both. I'll take the confession at face value thanks.
As a tax-payer I resent his passing his tax burden onto me.
This may not bother you in Malaysia though. Speaking of which, I'm sure
you are appropriately paying your expatriate taxes.
BTW, it makes me cry when you call me anonymouse.
| |
| parrthenon@cs.com 2005-03-26, 9:53 pm |
| <You really need to learn how to use a newsreader properly, and reply
to the message you are responding to. Bobby is guilty of both not
paying taxes, and defying the executive order. He has proudly admitted
both. I'll take the confession at face value thanks.> Anonymouse
Fischer is guilty of many things, as are we all, but you must
really need to learn how to use a newsreader properly. The question:
"What was Bobby Fischer convicted of?"
The answer anonymous is groping for: "Nothing."
Athough he was indicted for defying an executive order, he has not
as yet faced trial or been convicted. And he has not as yet been
charged with tax evasion. A charge is not a conviction. Until convicted
in a court of law, he is not a criminal. Period.
Rave on.
| |
| Eustace 2005-03-27, 3:52 am |
| Ray Gordon wrote:
quote:
>
> ...
> Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to care
> about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and they were
> equally colorful.
100 years from now of course Fischer's political views will be a small
but not unimportant part of his biography, as today are those of Paul
Morphy. I copy from Wikipedia:
==================
(After quitting chess) He then began to think of beginning his law
career. Unfortunately, he was unable to, as in 1861 the American Civil
War broke out, disrupting life in New Orleans. Opposed to secession,
Morphy did not serve in the Confederate Army but remained for a while in
New Orleans, then left the city for Paris. He lived for a time in Paris
to avoid the war, returning to New Orleans afterwards.
His principled stance against the war was unpopular in his native South,
and he was unable to begin practice of the law after the war. Attempts
to open a law office failed due to a lack of clients; if anyone came to
his office, it was invariably in regards to chess. Financially secure
thanks to his family fortune, Morphy had effectively no profession and
he spent the rest of his life in idleness. Asked by admirers to play
chess again, he refused...
Morphy's final years were tragic. Depressed, he spent his last years
wandering around the French Quarter of New Orleans, talking to people no
one else could see, and having irrational feelings of persecution.
==================
From a progressive viewpoint, Fisher's, like Morphy's, political ideas,
though exaggerated and ill-presented, are basically correct and up to
the point. It goes without saying that they are also extremely unpopular
among the many conservative and politically misinformed contemporary
Americans.
There is no question that the 9/11 strikes were a direct result of the
US foreign policy in the Middle East (unconditional support for Israel,
continued embargo against Iraq that caused over 1,500,000 deaths,
military bases in Saudi Arabia). It is clear that Zionists, either
directly or through their notorious AIPAC lobby, exert inordinate
influence over US foreign policies. It is also historically a fact that
the extermination of the Native Americans and the colonization of
Palestine are criminal acts. These are the main truths behind Fischer's
"rantings". (Of course I don't expect to convince those who do not want
to be convinced...)
BTW, compared with Paul Morphy, Bobby Fischer seems to be doing
psychologically much better. It is important that he does not hear
voices, a typical symptom of schizophrenia. And he has developed a
stable emotional relation, which diagnostically is not insignificant.
Regards,
Eustace
| |
| Hans Jørgen Lassen 2005-03-27, 3:52 am |
| "Eustace" wrote:
quote:
> There is no question that the 9/11 strikes were a direct result of the US
> foreign policy in the Middle East (unconditional support for Israel,
> continued embargo against Iraq that caused over 1,500,000 deaths, military
> bases in Saudi Arabia). It is clear that Zionists, either directly or
> through their notorious AIPAC lobby, exert inordinate influence over US
> foreign policies. It is also historically a fact that the extermination of
> the Native Americans and the colonization of Palestine are criminal acts.
> These are the main truths behind Fischer's "rantings". (Of course I don't
> expect to convince those who do not want to be convinced...)
No, those last mentioned will probably react by calling you a racist or even
a neo-Nazi! Just wait til Wlod sees your post. This is exactly what would
get his rage boiling.
HansJ
| |
| Peter van der Hoog 2005-03-27, 6:51 am |
| "The Masked Bishop" <tmb@chesscave.com> schreef in bericht
news:AA%0e.14368$DW.11150@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
quote:
> Bobby's back in style, now standing on Icelandic soil, flanked by his new
> hosts who are still flush with the emotion of flash celebrity that comes
> to
> people who don't often get recognized for anything.
>
> And what does he have to say? Oh, the usual: the USA is evil, chess sucks,
> and the Jews are out to get him. Standard boiler-plate Fischer, the usual
> paranoid rantings of someone with clear mental problems.
>
> Had any of you friends or loved ones who acted like this, you'd get them
> help. But Fischer doesn't get help--he gets a citizenship, from the good
> taxpayers of Iceland, who now have made the world news for the first time
> since...1972?
>
> They must be so proud.
>
>
In fact Fischer is behaving himself, compared with the radio interviews,
very well. In the many interviews he gave after his release he did not use
the word "f*cking" once, which is remarkable for somebody who has been
unlawfully detained for nine months (and proofs that he does not suffer from
the Tourette syndrome, as Tim Krabbe once suggested). Furthermore, his
ranting towards Jews, is limited to one phrase, "The Jew-controlled USA".
"You have to fight with fire, They are using words, bullshit words to put me
in jail, so you have to use some more bullshit words, to get me out of
jail".
| |
| Hans Jørgen Lassen 2005-03-27, 6:51 am |
| "Peter van der Hoog" wrote:
quote:
> In fact Fischer is behaving himself, compared with the radio interviews,
> very well. In the many interviews he gave after his release he did not
> use the word "f*cking" once, which is remarkable for somebody who has been
> unlawfully detained for nine months (and proofs that he does not suffer
> from the Tourette syndrome, as Tim Krabbe once suggested). Furthermore,
> his ranting towards Jews, is limited to one phrase, "The Jew-controlled
> USA".
I dont know anything about power circles in the US. But there must be some
explanation why the US assaults Iraq, that never to my knowledge tried to
conquer the US, but on the other hand supports Israel in their illegal
colonization of land of their neighbours.
If Fischer's explanation is not correct, and of course it does not have to
be, then what is the explanation?
HansJ
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| > <Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
quote:
> care about what Fischer said? Look back at the first champions and
> they were equally colorful.> Ray Gordon
>
> True. As long as chess is played, Fischer's masterpieces will
> remain immortal. "Pay attention to Fischer's games, not his opinions,"
> wrote GM Evans in Chess Life, March 2005.
>
> Working quietly behind the scenes Boris Spassky, Larry Evans, Don
> Schultz and other noted chessers helped persuade Iceland to grant
> Fischer asylum. Every little bit helped.
>
> As I noted earlier, "Bobby deserves his freedom not because he's a
> decent human being but because he's not a criminal. In that sense,
> his fight is our fight. But only in that sense."
Generally, the poster children for causes like Fischer's will be people like
Fischer, i.e., the most extreme.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| >> <Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
quote:
>
> Yes, and today nobody remembers Wagner's anti-semitism right? <snort>
Fischer was a chessplayer. Wagner was not.
quote:
> Shame on them all. Particularly Schultz, the USCF doesn't need leaders
> who
> aid and abet criminals.
Fischer is not a criminal. America was seeking to extradite him, and he was
fighting that extradition, which is within his rights. That he was in jail
while he proved he had a right to go to Iceland is immaterial; many people
who are acquitted had to spend time in jail.
quote:
>
> Yes, actually he is.
He has not been convicted of anything, and the justice system in Japan
decided that it was proper not to even require him to fight the charges.
Nelson Mandela spent 27 years in prison; does that make him a criminal?
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| >> Do you really think that 100 years from now anyone is really going to
quote:
> care
> were
>
> Mr. Gordon has an odd definition of 'colorful', and shows great
> ignorance of chess history. No world champion has ever come close to
> Fischer for utter offensiveness. Even Alekhine's 'Jewish and Aryan
> Chess' articles are mild by comparison with what Fischer has said.
Said the man who obviously never shared a dinner table with Alekhine.
Alekhine pissed on the floor of a chess hall during a title match once
because he was drunk. I forget if he won the game that day or not.
quote:
> It's been nearly 60 years since Alekhine died, and his articles are
> still very well remembered. I doubt that Fischer's much more
> inflammatory statements will be forgotten a century from now.
As a chessplayer, Alekhine has a huge following, and his name is sprayed all
over opening theory. His Alekhine-Chatard attack is on the verge of
becoming the main line of the classical French.
Who gives a shit what he did away from the board?
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| >> And a game 1,000 times stronger than his critics could ever hope to
quote:
> achieve.
>
> I don't recall Bobby playing ANY games in the past 13 years.
Does that make him suddenly weak?
His game was at a level where even age shouldn't slow him down much, any
more than it would stop you or me from knowing how to add 2 and 2.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| >>>And what does he have to say? Oh, the usual: the USA is evil, chess
quote:
>
> 100 years from now of course Fischer's political views will be a small but
> not unimportant part of his biography, as today are those of Paul Morphy.
> I copy from Wikipedia:
Right. They will be used to explain who he is, but the final judgment will
be based on his chessplaying, as it should be.
He did not get paid money to throw a world series, after all, which would
stick, just as the steroid scandals in baseball will tarnish its history for
the entire century.
quote:
> ==================
> (After quitting chess) He then began to think of beginning his law career.
> Unfortunately, he was unable to, as in 1861 the American Civil War broke
> out, disrupting life in New Orleans. Opposed to secession, Morphy did not
> serve in the Confederate Army but remained for a while in New Orleans,
> then left the city for Paris. He lived for a time in Paris to avoid the
> war, returning to New Orleans afterwards.
He found a flight square.
quote:
> His principled stance against the war was unpopular in his native South,
> and he was unable to begin practice of the law after the war. Attempts to
> open a law office failed due to a lack of clients; if anyone came to his
> office, it was invariably in regards to chess. Financially secure thanks
> to his family fortune, Morphy had effectively no profession and he spent
> the rest of his life in idleness. Asked by admirers to play chess again,
> he refused...
That's chess related.
quote:
> Morphy's final years were tragic. Depressed, he spent his last years
> wandering around the French Quarter of New Orleans, talking to people no
> one else could see, and having irrational feelings of persecution.
> ==================
>
> From a progressive viewpoint, Fisher's, like Morphy's, political ideas,
> though exaggerated and ill-presented, are basically correct and up to the
> point. It goes without saying that they are also extremely unpopular among
> the many conservative and politically misinformed contemporary Americans.
>
> There is no question that the 9/11 strikes were a direct result of the US
> foreign policy in the Middle East (unconditional support for Israel,
> continued embargo against Iraq that caused over 1,500,000 deaths, military
> bases in Saudi Arabia). It is clear that Zionists, either directly or
> through their notorious AIPAC lobby, exert inordinate influence over US
> foreign policies. It is also historically a fact that the extermination of
> the Native Americans and the colonization of Palestine are criminal acts.
> These are the main truths behind Fischer's "rantings". (Of course I don't
> expect to convince those who do not want to be convinced...)
>
> BTW, compared with Paul Morphy, Bobby Fischer seems to be doing
> psychologically much better. It is important that he does not hear voices,
> a typical symptom of schizophrenia. And he has developed a stable
> emotional relation, which diagnostically is not insignificant.
Many have Fischer's political beliefs. They are irrelevant to his
chessplaying, except to the extent that they explain why he did or did not
play, and from a biographical perspective.
It doesn't make his win over Byrne at age 13 any less brilliant.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| > Bobby is guilty of both not paying taxes, and defying the executive
quote:
> order.
He has not been convicted of either.
He could simply be viewed as late in filing his returns (I worked for
accounting firms where this was routine) and cut a deal with the IRS, and
it's up to a court to determine if the match in Yugoslavia was a crime.
Ever see those commercials where they say you can settle your tax debt for
pennies on the dollar? Fischer should have as much right to that as anyone
else.
Should anyone who purchsaed an Informant during the sanctions now be
imprisoned?
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| > Athough he was indicted for defying an executive order, he has not
quote:
> as yet faced trial or been convicted. And he has not as yet been
> charged with tax evasion. A charge is not a conviction. Until convicted
> in a court of law, he is not a criminal. Period.
Taxwise, he's no different than Willie Nelson (remember "Who'll Buy My
Memories?" That albumb was IRS-inspired), or Redd Foxx were when they had
their problems, as far as the IRS is concerned, or even Mike Tyson today
(Tyson owes a fortune as well). He owes more than he could pay, and that's
that. There are cases with billionaires that involve amounts which dwarfs
what Fischer would owe and they get resolved without prison. Fischer's
earning power is such that the IRS would much rather have him on the rolls
than lock him up where he can't earn any money.
How many people who say his match was illegal purchased an Informant during
that time?
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
| >> In fact Fischer is behaving himself, compared with the radio interviews,
quote:
>
> I dont know anything about power circles in the US. But there must be some
> explanation why the US assaults Iraq, that never to my knowledge tried to
> conquer the US, but on the other hand supports Israel in their illegal
> colonization of land of their neighbours.
>
> If Fischer's explanation is not correct, and of course it does not have to
> be, then what is the explanation?
I've always thought that the primary justification for the war in the Middle
East is that these people are trying to tell us who we can have for friends
(i.e., Israel).
They can say Iraq never did anything to us, but we never did anything to
these countries other than be allies with Israel. How is that justification
for bombing us on our homeland?
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| David Ames 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
|
Hans J=F8rgen Lassen wrote:
quote:
> "Peter van der Hoog" wrote:
>
interviews,[vbcol=seagreen]
not[vbcol=seagreen]
has been[vbcol=seagreen]
suffer[vbcol=seagreen]
Furthermore,[vbcol=seagreen]
Jew-controlled[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> I dont know anything about power circles in the US. But there must be
some
quote:
> explanation why the US assaults Iraq, that never to my knowledge
tried to
quote:
> conquer the US, but on the other hand supports Israel in their
illegal
quote:
> colonization of land of their neighbours.
I believe the correct statement would be "supports Israel." To the
best of my knowledge, the US does not specifically support colonization
of Israel's neighbors' land. In fact, the current Israel government
has been withdrawing from various towns in Arab areas.
The campaign against Iraq was foolhardy, as history books will tell you
fifteen years from now.
quote:
>
> If Fischer's explanation is not correct, and of course it does not
have to=20
quote:
> be, then what is the explanation?
>=20
> HansJ
| |
| R.P. Warren 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
|
Ray Gordon wrote:
quote:
> Alekhine pissed on the floor of a chess hall during a title match
once
quote:
> because he was drunk. I forget if he won the game that day or not.
More ignorance. The incident you describe never happened. Can you tell
us your source for this fable?
| |
| Tyrone Slothrop 2005-03-27, 5:51 pm |
|
Ray Gordon wrote:
quote:
he's a[vbcol=seagreen]
sense,[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Nelson Mandela spent 27 years in prison; does that make him a
criminal?
I'm impressed. Great example to use against those who implicitly
believe that America is at the center of the world and that every other
country is just a satellite. Bravo.
| |
| Ken Albin 2005-03-28, 3:53 am |
| Not suddenly weak. Add up his eccentric behavior for years that had to
have impacted upon his diet (witness his current physique) and his
current age. He was estimated to be playing around 2600 in the 1992
match. This is barely acceptable for a world class grandmaster. That
was 13 years ago with his chess left in limbo. As much as I would love
to say that time has no effect upon play, it does. Arteries harden,
cellular damage accumulates, etc... With the possible exception of
Lasker, most strong players decline in their skills as they age. It's a
sad fact of life. Even Karpov is not as sharp today as he was 25 years
ago.
Even if he has been keeping up with chess study, Fischer would be
fortunate today to play at more than 2500-2550 strength. Formidible,
but a lot of grandmasters today would have a more than reasonable
chance of beating him in a match (assuming he would ever play).
I was a fan of Reshevsky, but even he lost roughly 200 rating points in
his golden years.
Ken Albin
| |
| Paul Rubin 2005-03-28, 3:53 am |
| "Ken Albin" <albink@aug.com> writes:
quote:
> Even if he has been keeping up with chess study, Fischer would be
> fortunate today to play at more than 2500-2550 strength. Formidible,
> but a lot of grandmasters today would have a more than reasonable
> chance of beating him in a match (assuming he would ever play).
I remember S. Polgar saying in the 90's that Fischer had gotten rusty
over the board, but that is understanding of the game was still as
deep as anyone's. Aging players lose stamina and maybe tactical
calculation ability, but their understanding and intuition stays
strong. Najdorf in his 80's was apparently still an extremely
dangerous blitz player even if he wasn't likely to win top level OTB
tournaments any more.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-28, 3:53 am |
| > Not suddenly weak. Add up his eccentric behavior for years that had to
quote:
> have impacted upon his diet (witness his current physique) and his
> current age. He was estimated to be playing around 2600 in the 1992
> match.
Since he won handily, he could easily have had a lot more left in the tank.
quote:
>This is barely acceptable for a world class grandmaster. That
> was 13 years ago with his chess left in limbo. As much as I would love
> to say that time has no effect upon play, it does. Arteries harden,
> cellular damage accumulates, etc... With the possible exception of
> Lasker, most strong players decline in their skills as they age. It's a
> sad fact of life. Even Karpov is not as sharp today as he was 25 years
> ago.
Why would he have to be?
quote:
> Even if he has been keeping up with chess study, Fischer would be
> fortunate today to play at more than 2500-2550 strength. Formidible,
> but a lot of grandmasters today would have a more than reasonable
> chance of beating him in a match (assuming he would ever play).
I doubt he's gotten that weak. More likely, he won't train the way he used
to, but it's very difficult to "unlearn" chess, which he'd almost have to do
to lose to anyone other than maybe Kasparov right now.
A Fischer-Karpov match would be intriguing, as both are within range of each
other's age.
quote:
> I was a fan of Reshevsky, but even he lost roughly 200 rating points in
> his golden years.
I would think this is due more to previous accomplishments and complacency
than age per se.
Korchnoi is still quite deadly at age 72, and made the Candidates' matches
when he was 56.
I think a better parallel to Fischer might be Steinitz, who was operating
from a different theoretical framework when he won the title at age 50. If
Fischer understands things about chess that others do not, his age is not
likely to even come into play as it would if both players are copying the
same playbook.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-28, 3:53 am |
| >> Even if he has been keeping up with chess study, Fischer would be
quote:
>
> I remember S. Polgar saying in the 90's that Fischer had gotten rusty
> over the board, but that is understanding of the game was still as
> deep as anyone's. Aging players lose stamina and maybe tactical
> calculation ability, but their understanding and intuition stays
> strong. Najdorf in his 80's was apparently still an extremely
> dangerous blitz player even if he wasn't likely to win top level OTB
> tournaments any more.
Korchnoi won an international tournament at age 72.
That he never became world champion may have something to do with him
staying serious.
If baseball players can hit 50 homers or win the Cy Young award past age 40,
you would figure a chessplayer could make it to at least 60 if not 70.
Kasparov at age 45 is still dominant.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
| |
| Peter van der Hoog 2005-03-28, 6:51 am |
| "Peter van der Hoog" <vanderhoog@yahoo.com> schreef in bericht
news:114d2gjdjoh157b@corp.supernews.com...
quote:
> "The Masked Bishop" <tmb@chesscave.com> schreef in bericht
> news:AA%0e.14368$DW.11150@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com...
> ...his ranting towards Jews, is limited to one phrase, "The Jew-controlled
> USA".
Efraim Zukoff, from the Wiesenthal center: "Listen to his ranting and raving
comments at his press conference in Reikjavic on Friday to understand that
Iceland has made a big mistake here". Either Efraim Zukoff is shocked by
Fischer's "Jew-controlled USA" or he managed to get hold of different
fragments of the same interview.
| |
| Peter van der Hoog 2005-03-28, 5:56 pm |
| "Peter van der Hoog" <vanderhoog@yahoo.com> schreef in bericht
news:114fmhkeihvd863@corp.supernews.com...[vbcol=seagreen]
> "Peter van der Hoog" <vanderhoog@yahoo.com> schreef in bericht
> news:114d2gjdjoh157b@corp.supernews.com...
But I missed this one:
So the endgame. I head back to the Loftleidir. Fischer has finished lunch,
trimmed his beard, had a haircut. He has decided to give a press conference
to the 20 or so journalists camped in the lobby. The presence of American
sports journalist Jeremy Schaap adds a frisson. He is the son of Dick
Schaap, a New Yorker who was a close friend of the young Bobby but later
declared that Fischer was mad. Fischer quickly makes the connection
(Schaap's TV channel, sports broadcaster ESPN, may have planned it this
way). "I knew your father," he drawls to the young, dark-haired Schaap. "He
said I didn't have a sane bone in my body: I don't forget that."
I ask about chess; a Russian TV crew asks about Kasparov; the Icelanders ask
whether Fischer likes herring, but the Schaap affair won't go away. Fischer
insists on returning to it, and things suddenly turn ugly. "Let me get back
to this guy," says Fischer, pointing at Schaap. "I hate to rap people
personally, but his father many years ago befriended me, took me to see
Knicks games, acted kind of like a father figure, and then later, like a
typical Jewish snake, he had the most vicious things to say about me."
Schaap snaps at that, says "I don't know that you've done much here today
really to disprove anything he said," and walks out. All on camera. Maybe
it's a made-for-TV set-up, maybe not, but it certainly chills the air:
Fischer groans and there is a half-minute silence before the woman from
Icelandic radio can get things back on track with another question about
herring. The human being starts to emerge from under the baseball cap, then
bang, he's off again with another lengthy exposition of his intricately
wrought, completely bonkers theories, usually rounded off with: "It's all on
the internet! Why don't you go look it up?"
| |
| Adrian MacNair 2005-03-28, 5:56 pm |
| "Ray Gordon" <ray@cybersheet.com> wrote in message
news:FAy1e.36567$qn2.8566431@twister.nyc.rr.com...
quote:
>
> Does that make him suddenly weak?
>
> His game was at a level where even age shouldn't slow him down much, any
> more than it would stop you or me from knowing how to add 2 and 2.
I would speculate that Fischer would be as rusty as anybody having not
played for so long. Having said that, I think if he put as much insane
effort into practice now as he did when he was a "contender" he could rise
to play in the top class again. We must not ignore the 30+ years of
improvements to the openings which Fischer thinks is fixed, and the many GMs
who make a career by studying these openings into submission.
| |
| Paul Rubin 2005-03-28, 5:56 pm |
| "Peter van der Hoog" <vanderhoog@yahoo.com> writes:
quote:
> The human being starts to emerge from under the baseball cap, then
> bang, he's off again with another lengthy exposition of his
> intricately wrought, completely bonkers theories, usually rounded
> off with: "It's all on the internet! Why don't you go look it up?"
Fischer cruises the internet? Interesting. I wonder if he's reading
this newsgroup.
| |
| Ken Albin 2005-03-29, 3:56 am |
| > remember S. Polgar saying in the 90's that Fischer had gotten rusty
quote:
> over the board, but that is understanding of the game was still as
> deep as anyone's. Aging players lose stamina and maybe tactical
> calculation ability, but their understanding and intuition stays
> strong.
It probably varies with the specific health issues of the player, but
generally I agree that some older players can compensate for age to a
degree by experience. It wouldn't be enough to place Fischer in the top
100 but it might make for an entertaining match with a suitable
opponent. His determination and stubborn streak certainly haven't
lessened over the years.
It's interesting to speculate on Fischer having the ability to regain
much of his old form, but sometimes it may be better to just let it
remain speculation. Reality can disappoint.
| |
| Ray Gordon 2005-03-29, 3:56 am |
| >> remember S. Polgar saying in the 90's that Fischer had gotten rusty
quote:
>
> It probably varies with the specific health issues of the player, but
> generally I agree that some older players can compensate for age to a
> degree by experience. It wouldn't be enough to place Fischer in the top
> 100
I don't see where Fischer would be out of even the top five, if he trained
now as he trained then, but that's the key; he won't.
--
Ray Gordon, Author
http://www.cybersheet.com/easy.html
Seduction Made Easy. Get this book FREE when you buy participating
affiliated books!
http://www.cybersheet.com/library.html
The Seduction Library. Four free books to get you started on your quest to
get laid.
Don't buy anything from experts who won't debate on a free speech forum.
|
| |
|
|