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Home > Archive > Chess politics > November 2004 > AUTO DA FE
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| Chess One 2004-11-21, 9:45 am |
| AUTO DA FE
In a very disturbing report on Fide doping, which has strong implications
for the future.
I note from the Fide text* that;-
a) although Fide admit to not quite following any coherent written or verbal
procedure, it admits no fault of itself, and does not modulate its
judgments thereby.
b) there is a presumption of guilt of the accused.
c) the accused person's testimony is termed 'a confession' rather than, eg,
'a statement.'
d) stronger measures are intended;
"...judges unanimously that in future cases the Panel will in all
probability be forced to impose two years of ineligibility, even if an
amateur is concerned." even though elsewhere, the stated intention of the
regulations is to regulate professional players.
e) the penalties imposed below are to remove points scored by the player in
a TEAM competition, and therefore any dissent will result in a TEAM penalty.
f) by refusing a test Susan Polgar would have forfeited her own points in
the recently concluded Olympiad, and her teams score would also be reduced,
hence the US team's medal would also be forfeit in this case.
g) by extending a points-penalty to a team, a player who in an act of
individual conscience declines to be tested, is now in effect penalising all
players in the team, and the values we uphold in the West of acting from
individual conscience is now eliminated from chess.
Phil Innes
* I didn't include it here, perhaps there is a URL?
| |
| Martin Sims 2004-11-21, 5:46 pm |
| Ivanchuk also submitted to a dope test rather than jeopardise Ukraine's gold
medal.
Congratulations to Shaun Press and Bobby Miller for standing up for their
rights. And what the hell was Speelman doing on the panel? I thought he was
one of the good guys?
"Chess One" <innes8@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:Qw0od.2578$356.1093@trndny04...
quote:
> AUTO DA FE
>
> In a very disturbing report on Fide doping, which has strong implications
> for the future.
>
> I note from the Fide text* that;-
>
> a) although Fide admit to not quite following any coherent written or
verbal
quote:
> procedure, it admits no fault of itself, and does not modulate its
> judgments thereby.
>
> b) there is a presumption of guilt of the accused.
>
> c) the accused person's testimony is termed 'a confession' rather than,
eg,
quote:
> 'a statement.'
>
> d) stronger measures are intended;
>
> "...judges unanimously that in future cases the Panel will in all
> probability be forced to impose two years of ineligibility, even if an
> amateur is concerned." even though elsewhere, the stated intention of the
> regulations is to regulate professional players.
>
> e) the penalties imposed below are to remove points scored by the player
in
quote:
> a TEAM competition, and therefore any dissent will result in a TEAM
penalty.
quote:
>
> f) by refusing a test Susan Polgar would have forfeited her own points in
> the recently concluded Olympiad, and her teams score would also be
reduced,
quote:
> hence the US team's medal would also be forfeit in this case.
>
> g) by extending a points-penalty to a team, a player who in an act of
> individual conscience declines to be tested, is now in effect penalising
all
quote:
> players in the team, and the values we uphold in the West of acting from
> individual conscience is now eliminated from chess.
>
> Phil Innes
>
> * I didn't include it here, perhaps there is a URL?
>
>
| |
| Chess One 2004-11-22, 12:47 am |
|
"Martin Sims" <msims@ihugSPAMMERSARESCUM.co.nz> wrote in message
news:cnr1fq$nme$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
quote:
> Ivanchuk also submitted to a dope test rather than jeopardise Ukraine's
> gold
> medal.
>
> Congratulations to Shaun Press and Bobby Miller for standing up for their
> rights. And what the hell was Speelman doing on the panel? I thought he
> was
> one of the good guys?
If it came to a choice for match organisers between Fide and either of these
guys, then I know which way I'll decide. Pehaps it will come down to this
the world over? Phil
quote:
> "Chess One" <innes8@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:Qw0od.2578$356.1093@trndny04...
> verbal
> eg,
> in
> penalty.
> reduced,
> all
>
>
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-11-22, 6:46 am |
| <<Congratulations to Shaun Press and Bobby Miller for standing up for their
rights. And what the hell was Speelman doing on the panel? I thought he was one
of the good guys?>> -- Martin Sims
Right.
One expects jackbooted behavior from the FIDE org men, but Jon Speelman's
presence depresses. I figure he got maneuvered into taking a place on the
Commission in the hope of stopping the nonsense but failed to realize that by
participating in the process he inevitably bears some responsibility for the
irrationality and injustice.
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-11-22, 6:46 am |
| FROM BRITISH GM RAY KEENE
Speelman of course voted against, but the committee was fixed so as always to
have a pro-test majority.
I have spoken to Speelman and think he is thorughly disgusted with the process.
Of course, had I been the token player on the committee -- fat chance -- I
would have disrupted affairs with a press conference, statements, walkouts,
etc.
But, alas, Speelman is just not that kind of guy.
-- Ray Keene
| |
|
| parrthenon@cs.com (Parrthenon) wrote in message news:<20041122025426.23348.00001058@mb-m03.news.cs.com>...
quote:
> FROM BRITISH GM RAY KEENE
>
> Speelman of course voted against, but the committee was fixed so as always to
> have a pro-test majority.
>
> I have spoken to Speelman and think he is thorughly disgusted with the process.
> Of course, had I been the token player on the committee -- fat chance -- I
> would have disrupted affairs with a press conference, statements, walkouts,
> etc.
>
> But, alas, Speelman is just not that kind of guy.
>
> -- Ray Keene
Are you foolish enough to think the Olympics will change their minds
for a handful of chess players? FIDE might change their minds if ALL
players refuse to be drug-tested at ALL tournaments ALL the time.
Forget the Olympics in that case.
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-11-23, 12:48 am |
| <<FIDE might change their minds if ALL
players refuse to be drug-tested at ALL tournaments ALL the time.>> -- 5et2
No one here thinks chess ever will be "in the Olympics" -- as that phrase is
commonly understood. The Olympic Committee would not accommodate major league
baseball with all of its financial, legal and social resources, and the pygmy
of FIDE never stood a chance in the first place. It was a sham from the start.
As GM Larry Evans repeatedly stated, "There is no better way than drug
testing to drive people away from chess."
Drug testing is now about building a permanent medical commission that
can control players and snuff out dissent. It is the ideal hangout for the
Azmaiparashvilis and Ilyumzhinovs and, yes, the Morten Sands and David Jarretts
of the world and their ilk.
Drug testing is about officialdom and has absolutely nothing to do
with drugs. No drug ever has been shown to affect play positively.
As for money, we went through this process ad nauseum. Less than one
million dollars worldwide comes to chess because of this testing. A pittance.
The budget for testing drugs will eventually exceed the picayune financial
intake.
Like a toll authority that exhausts the tolls raised by its existence,
drug testing is about supporting a new layer of officialdom.
It is time for American players to force the hand of the USCF
Executive Board via a petition. A new version of an earlier petition will soon
appear here, and I call for volunteers to join a committee against drug
testing.
Yours, Larry Parr
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
| |
| Martin Sims 2004-11-26, 6:45 am |
| Ivanchuk also submitted to a dope test rather than jeopardise Ukraine's gold
medal.
Congratulations to Shaun Press and Bobby Miller for standing up for their
rights. And what the hell was Speelman doing on the panel? I thought he was
one of the good guys?
"Chess One" <innes8@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:Qw0od.2578$356.1093@trndny04...
quote:
> AUTO DA FE
>
> In a very disturbing report on Fide doping, which has strong implications
> for the future.
>
> I note from the Fide text* that;-
>
> a) although Fide admit to not quite following any coherent written or
verbal
quote:
> procedure, it admits no fault of itself, and does not modulate its
> judgments thereby.
>
> b) there is a presumption of guilt of the accused.
>
> c) the accused person's testimony is termed 'a confession' rather than,
eg,
quote:
> 'a statement.'
>
> d) stronger measures are intended;
>
> "...judges unanimously that in future cases the Panel will in all
> probability be forced to impose two years of ineligibility, even if an
> amateur is concerned." even though elsewhere, the stated intention of the
> regulations is to regulate professional players.
>
> e) the penalties imposed below are to remove points scored by the player
in
quote:
> a TEAM competition, and therefore any dissent will result in a TEAM
penalty.
quote:
>
> f) by refusing a test Susan Polgar would have forfeited her own points in
> the recently concluded Olympiad, and her teams score would also be
reduced,
quote:
> hence the US team's medal would also be forfeit in this case.
>
> g) by extending a points-penalty to a team, a player who in an act of
> individual conscience declines to be tested, is now in effect penalising
all
quote:
> players in the team, and the values we uphold in the West of acting from
> individual conscience is now eliminated from chess.
>
> Phil Innes
>
> * I didn't include it here, perhaps there is a URL?
>
>
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-11-26, 6:45 am |
| FROM BRITISH GM RAY KEENE
Speelman of course voted against, but the committee was fixed so as always to
have a pro-test majority.
I have spoken to Speelman and think he is thorughly disgusted with the process.
Of course, had I been the token player on the committee -- fat chance -- I
would have disrupted affairs with a press conference, statements, walkouts,
etc.
But, alas, Speelman is just not that kind of guy.
-- Ray Keene
| |
|
| parrthenon@cs.com (Parrthenon) wrote in message news:<20041122025426.23348.00001058@mb-m03.news.cs.com>...
quote:
> FROM BRITISH GM RAY KEENE
>
> Speelman of course voted against, but the committee was fixed so as always to
> have a pro-test majority.
>
> I have spoken to Speelman and think he is thorughly disgusted with the process.
> Of course, had I been the token player on the committee -- fat chance -- I
> would have disrupted affairs with a press conference, statements, walkouts,
> etc.
>
> But, alas, Speelman is just not that kind of guy.
>
> -- Ray Keene
Are you foolish enough to think the Olympics will change their minds
for a handful of chess players? FIDE might change their minds if ALL
players refuse to be drug-tested at ALL tournaments ALL the time.
Forget the Olympics in that case.
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-11-29, 12:46 am |
| <<Congratulations to Shaun Press and Bobby Miller for standing up for their
rights. And what the hell was Speelman doing on the panel? I thought he was one
of the good guys?>> -- Martin Sims
Right.
One expects jackbooted behavior from the FIDE org men, but Jon Speelman's
presence depresses. I figure he got maneuvered into taking a place on the
Commission in the hope of stopping the nonsense but failed to realize that by
participating in the process he inevitably bears some responsibility for the
irrationality and injustice.
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
|
| |
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