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Goichberg's Relocation Report
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|
| Parrthenon 2004-10-26, 5:46 pm |
| Subj: Relocation Report
Date: 10/15/2004 5:54:24 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Chessoffice
To: Beatchess, timothyhanke@comcast.net, stephenshutt@yahoo.com,
bradyfm@msn.com, Chessdon, elizabethshaughnessy@hotmail.com,
Randy.Bauer@iowa.gov, LWDubeck, sbooz@boozmajor.com, ilyag@mindspring.com,
jon@bocachess.com, mrcarr@pacbell.net, knudson1@home.com
RELOCATION REPORT
Oct 15, 2004
This report compares the Crossville and Liberty bids including anticipated
financial impact over a 15 year period. After Randy Bauer reports on Lindsborg
I will try to add that bid to the comparisons.
Purchase/build cost: Crossville $540,000, Liberty $250,000.
Lindsborg $0.
This assumes a 6000 square foor building in Crossville, which is what we
announced to potential bidders that we needed. Beatriz has recently suggested
5000 or even 4000 square feet. 5000 square feet would lower the cost to
$450,000 but I am afraid would require renting warehouse space for storage and
our library, and 4000 square feet seems totally inadequate.
Renovation cost for Liberty:
Painting the building inside and outside: $65,000.
New carpeting or tile: $70,000.
Phone system &electronics: $8000 for the first floor, which would be used for
USCF headquarters. For other floors this would be up to our tenants.
Additional fluorescent lighting: $18,000. We could hold this to $6,000 by
doing only the first floor.
Electric updates: We don't require an unusual amount of power, so probably
nothing, but let's allow $10,000.
Plumbing work to partition the heating system into separate sectors: probably
less but let's allow $10,000.
I'm not sure if any upgrade of windows is necessary to improve insulation, but
let's allow $10,000 just in case. The building seems naturally resistant to
outdoor temperatures; the heat has been shut off, but when we visited Monday it
was cold outdoors but much warmer inside.
Total $191,000.
Renovation cost for Lindsborg: We had heard $100,000 before and after seeing
Randy's report it still sounds like this may be about right.
Outdoor maintenance: The seller estimates $10,000 per year for grounds care
and snow removal in Liberty. I don't know what the cost would be to maintain
the undeveloped farmland in Crossville, maybe $3000 per year? Of course, we're
comparing apples to oranges here as Liberty has very impressive landscaped
grounds while Crossville is undeveloped land without even a tree on it.
I don't think Randy said anything about the grounds at Lindsborg. I think the
location is downtown and there may not be much land so am guessing $1000 per
year for now.
Indoor maintenance:
Part of the roof in Liberty has not been updated since 1951. It doesn't leak,
but looking ahead, we will probably need to replace it before 15 years. Our
roof at 186 Rt 9W was in much worse shape and was redone at a cost of $9700
last year. Liberty has a slightly larger roof so I think $15,000 is a
reasonable estimate. This does not need to be done quickly. A new furnace was
installed about 15 years ago and works fine, so I doubt there will be major
repair expense in that area. Including the anticipated roof repair, I suggest
allowing an average of $10,000 per year for expenses, although I am not aware
of any likely major expense other than the roof.
For a new building in Crossville there should be little indoor cost in the
early years, but over 15 years, I'm guessing an average of $1000 per year.
Lindsborg's building is almost as old as Liberty but smaller, so I'm estimating
$4000 per year.
Property taxes: We don't have a definite assessed value for Liberty yet (the
last two occupants didn't pay taxes), but based on a discussion between the
Sullivan County Partnership and a town official, it is likely the full tax
after 20 years will be about $15,000 per year, $1000 less than we paid in New
Windsor. However, we are eligible for a tax abatement program under which we
would pay 10% of full tax in years 1 and 2, 20% in years 3 and 4, etc. Over 15
years, this would mean a total of $96,000.
For Crossville, I don't know what the tax would be on land and building, but we
recently received a tax bill for $492 for 10/04 to 2/05 for our land alone.
The bill says "Property value $120,000 (which sounds closer to the truth than
the $264,000 appraised value claimed by Crossville), assessed value $30,000."
If the land tax is $492 for five months, presumably it is $1181 for twelve
months. The building would be worth a lot more than the land so if it is taxed
at the same rate (and I'm not sure it would be) we might have at least $3500
tax per year, or $52,500 over 15 years, $43,500 less than Liberty.
I'll guess Lindsborg the same as Crossville.
Moving company cost: Looks like it will cost about $5500 to move to Liberty,
not counting employee time. Crossville is a double move, to Crossville next
year and to the new building in Crossville in 2006. The first move might cost
$12,000 and the second $5000, a total of $17,000.
Lindsborg: One move, $14,000.
Employee relocation cost: Crossville $12,000 assuming four employees at $3000
each.
Lindsborg $10,000 for three employees.
Employee time for move: We discussed our recent move from 3054 Rt 9W to 3068
Rt 9W at a senior staff meeting and decided that the work required packing and
unpacking plus the subsequent disruption of adjusting to new facilities
probably added up to about a month of salary with little productivity (other
than the move) for the employees who moved. Most employees would not move to
Crossville, but unpacking would still be necessary. Most Crossville employees
would be new, so moving disruption would be less of an issue on that end as
they would be unfamiliar with their work in any event. Overall, I estimate the
cost in employee time to be $50,000 for New Windsor to Liberty, $40,000 for New
Windsor to Crossville, and $50,000 a year later for Crossville to Crossville, a
total of Liberty $50,000, Crossville $90,000.
Lindsborg $50,000.
Cost and lost efficiency of hiring/training new employees: For Liberty we will
probably retain about 60% of our employees, for Crossville about 20%. New
employees will require training, causing lack of productivity both for them and
those who train them. Our current employees are a valuable asset, those who
survived downsizing while less cost effective people were replaced. I expect a
loss of efficiency that will gradually decrease but will last for years, and
with substantial member and affiliate dissatisfaction resulting. Our CFO Ken
Thomas, who was task force coordinator and documentarian for a division of
Thomas &Betts, has warned that a move that costs us 80% of our employees is
financially risky and should not be done without careful study by
professionals. There is no way to calculate the effect, but I estimate the true
longterm impact of losing that many experienced employees at $200,000 for
Crossville. For Liberty, where three times as many current employees would be
available to train others, I estimate $40,000.
Lindsborg $220,000.
Rental income (non-chess): John Lavelle estimates $63,000 per year for
Liberty, which seems reasonable as it assumes only about 50% occupancy of two
floors on the average. That's $945,000 over 15 years. However, as some Board
members have said we shouldn't be in the property management business, and as
property managers make 5% to 10% of income, let's assume we pay 10% of this to
a manager, leaving $850,000.
Chess income: If only half our space is rented for non-chess activities on the
average, we can rent some to organizers of chess camps, tournaments, seminars,
etc. or run our own such events. $5000 per year seems a conservative estimate
of such income.
Relocation compensation: Lindsborg $72,000.
Crossville 15-year summary: Build cost $540,000, outdoor maintenance $45,000,
indoor maintenance $15,000, taxes $52,500, moving company $17,000, employee
relocation $12,000, employee time spent moving $90,000, cost &lost efficiency
of hiring/retraining $200,000, total expense $971,500. If a 5000 square foor
building is enough, total cost is $881,500.
Liberty 15-year summary: Purchase cost $250,000, renovation $191,000, outdoor
maintenance $150,000, indoor maintenance $150,000, taxes $96,000, moving
company $5500, employee time spent moving $50,000, cost &lost efficiency of
hiring/retraining $40,000, total expense $932,500. Also rental income
$850,000, chess income $75,000, total income $925,000, so overall expense is
$7500, roughly breakeven.
Lindsborg 15-year summary: Purchase cost $0, renovation $100,000, outdoor
maintenance $15,000, indoor maintenance $60,000, taxes $52,500, moving company
$14,000, employee relocation $10,000, employee time spent moving $50,000, cost
& lost efficiency of hiring/retraining $220,000, total expense $521,500. Also
relocation compensation $72,000, so overall expense $449,500.
I believe that Liberty has roughly a $900,000 edge over Crossville. If rental
income is disappointing and/or renovation costs are unexpectedly high, a few
hundred thousand of this edge could disappear, but it is at least as likely
that this estimate will be too low by several hundred thousand.
OTHER CONSIDERATIONS:
Grounds: Liberty has impressive landscaped property with trees in an upscale
neighborhood, a few blocks away from the home of Alan Gerry, one of the 40
wealthiest people in the country, who has offered to sell us the Loomis
Building. About 5 acres is the building and grassy areas and 13 acres is
wooded. Crossville has 3 acres of undeveloped farmland, no trees, in an area
adjacent to mostly empty lots, which may eventually have more businesses.
I believe Lindsborg is downtown. Don't know how the appearance compares to the
others. The shortage of windows in the building is a minus.
Travel (according to expedia.com): Liberty is 47 miles from the nearest major
airport, Crossville 71 miles. Of metro areas of 2,000,000 and up, Liberty is
106 miles from New York, 188 miles from Philadelphia, 250 miles from Boston,
285 miles from Baltimore and 324 miles from Washington, while Crossville is 240
miles from Atlanta. Crossville is, however, also 113 miles from Nashville, 234
miles from Louisville, and 313 miles from Charlotte, the latter three being
metro areas of about 1,000,000 to 1,500,000.
Lindsborg is 20 miles from Salina, but Salina Airport appears to have flights
only from Kansas City, and not many. Wichita Airport is 70 miles away, and it
is 194 miles to Kansas City, MO.
Bill Goichberg
Financing: Crossville offers a no money down mortgage. For Liberty, the Gerry
Foundation may allow gradual payment to them instead of a mortgage, I don't
have an answer on this yet. If not, an option would be to open a CD for
$62,500 and use it as collateral. Sullivan County offers low interest
renovation loans but I have yet to receive the details.
Bill Goichberg
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-10-26, 5:46 pm |
| ONE MORE THING
Not included in the Goichberg report is the Erik Anderson AF4C intervention
which, given a few extra weeks , would likely make the Liberty proposal vastly
superior; Free rent for five years, likely elimination of any upfront money and
an option to buy after five years.
One wonders if the executive board took all this into consideration before
delaying their vote for a few weeks?
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
| |
| ChessforLife 2004-10-26, 5:46 pm |
| "
ONE MORE THING
Not included in the Goichberg report is the Erik Anderson AF4C intervention
which, given a few extra weeks , would likely make the Liberty proposal vastly
superior; Free rent for five years, likely elimination of any upfront money and
an option to buy after five years.
One wonders if the executive board took all this into consideration before
delaying their vote for a few weeks?"
ONE MORE THING
Include in the Bill Goichberg's reports his idea of selling spots in the
Executive Board to the AFFC.
Some people do anything for retaining control over the organization, even
selling seats on the EB.
I can tell you two thing, I will finish my term as President and make sure that
the move takes place.
Yours for Chess,
Beatriz Marinello
USCF President
| |
| ASCACHESS 2004-10-26, 5:46 pm |
| >RELOCATION REPORT
quote:
>Oct 15, 2004
>
>This report compares the Crossville and Liberty bids including anticipated
>financial impact over a 15 year period. After Randy Bauer reports on
>Lindsborg
>I will try to add that bid to the
>comparisons.
quote:
>Purchase/build cost: Crossville $540,000, Liberty $250,000.
The Crossville construction numbers sound about right, although moving costs
seem low.
The Liberty numbers for renovation seem to have been estimated by someone on
crack. They are preposterously low on their face, but ignore the sword of
damocles hanging over this site.
Has anyone with any experience done estimates, rather than our traditional old
guard, shoot from the hip method?
One word of warning on Liberty.
Asbestos.
Does anybody on this board have a clue what asbestos removal costs?
Did it even come up?
Hasn't anybody wondered why this building still stands?
The billionaire can't afford to tear it down so he is trying to foist it off on
the dummies from the chess federation.
Tearing it down would put EPA all over this site.
One can only sit back and marvel at these guys.
I swear, they would vote by committee on brain surgery and not one of them is a
doctor.
USCF can afford zero more blunders of Schultzian scale. This one could be it.
Our cheapest alternative would be to stay in NY and rent in Newburgh.
Rp
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-10-26, 5:46 pm |
| <<I can tell you two thing, I will finish my term as President and make sure
that the move takes place.>> -- Beatriz Marinello,
USCF President
Madame President:
We are pleased that you responded, but it sheds no light on the Crossville
vote.
Many questions remain unanswered.
We would all like to hear how the move to Crossville is good for chess and why
the board refused to grant a two-week delay before making a final decision.
What are the flaws in Bill Goichberg's relocation report?
I have an open mind on this issue and would like to hear the real reasons for
the board's decision to deny a two-week delay while other offers are explored.
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
| |
| Mike Nolan 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| ascachess@aol.com (ASCACHESS) writes:
quote:
>One word of warning on Liberty.
>Asbestos.
quote:
>Does anybody on this board have a clue what asbestos removal costs?
>Did it even come up?
I did raise that specific issue with a member of the Board last week.
I doubt they had time to bring in an expert to evaluate the building
for asbestos possibilies between when I raised the question and when
the board voted. (There are so many different places that asbestos
could have been used that unless it is obviously present it is not a
10 minute inspection job. In Lincoln it requires a permit just
to do an inspection for it, because the mere act of looking for it can
cause air quality issues.)
(The issue came up several times with regards to current or proposed
building issues when I was on the school board in Lincoln, so I'm VERY
aware both of the problem and the potential cost for remediation. I
also know of a non-profit organization in another state that accepted
a free building (in their case an old school building) and subsequently
learned they had a $2 million asbestos clean up problem on their hands.
quote:
>Our cheapest alternative would be to stay in NY and rent in Newburgh.
It might have been before the USCF took title to the property in Crossville
last year. I'm not so sure that was the case when the board voted.
--
Mike Nolan
| |
| ASCACHESS 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| >Many questions remain unanswered.
quote:
>
>We would all like to hear how the move to Crossville is good for chess and
>why
>the board refused to grant a two-week delay before making a final decision.
>
quote:
>What are the flaws in Bill Goichberg's relocation report?
Virtually all preWW2 buildings used asbestos as an insulator and these
buildings are a monetary time bomb for any non-profit dumb enough to take over
title.
This proposed gift horse, likely has typhoid.
Rp
| |
| Tim Hanke 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| Phil,
With all due respect, your construction cost numbers for Crossville are not
even close. You say it's $200 per square foot; actually it's closer to $90.
The rest of your analysis is no more accurate than your construction
numbers.
For example, your sweeping statement, "The org is almost broke and must now
expend its last possible resource to stay alive," is completely wrong. We
have several hundred thousand dollars cash in the bank, and won't have to
use any of it to construct our new building, because the Crossville bank is
offering us a low-interest, no-money-down loan.
Because we don't need cash to construct our new building in Crossville, we
have given the proceeds of the New Windsor building sale to USCF's LMA
Committee to manage. As a Life Member myself, and a New England cheapskate
to boot, you can bet I won't spend any more of our money than necessary. :-)
I (and others here) have provided a great deal of pertinent information
about the Crossville deal, but if you won't listen, you won't learn.
It's interesting that you won't listen to me, but you seem willing to
swallow the "Liberty tall tale" without asking any hard questions.
Tim Hanke
USCF Vice President of Finance
"Chess One" <innes8@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:XJAdd.5102$bV5.4367@trndny07...
quote:
>
>
> Tim, you are speaking like a politician not a VP Finance.
>
> How much to renovate the Liberty space needed? Can additional space be
> sub-let? Is it a tournament space? Why buy a space which requires new
> construction [which is $200 per sq foot!]
>
> I asked 5 questions in another thread not about the specific site, but
> about what USCF would do at such a site, they are all business questions -
> I doubt anyone will even attempt to answer them.
>
> Ho hum! The org is almost broke and must now expend its last possible
> resource to stay alive; and gone almost broke by self-admitted amateurs
> making fast decisions based on utterly inane fast-talk.
>
> You set on going for broke too? Lemmings ain't in it.
>
> Phil Innes
>
>
>
>
>
>
| |
| Chess One 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
|
quote:
>
> One wonders if Larry Parr has read anything I have posted on this
> subject. The Liberty building is a huge, 104-year-old hospital that
> would need substantial renovation and likely require high ongoing
> maintenance costs. I wouldn't want it FOR FREE.
Tim, you are speaking like a politician not a VP Finance.
How much to renovate the Liberty space needed? Can additional space be
sub-let? Is it a tournament space? Why buy a space which requires new
construction [which is $200 per sq foot!]
I asked 5 questions in another thread not about the specific site, but about
what USCF would do at such a site, they are all business questions - I doubt
anyone will even attempt to answer them.
Ho hum! The org is almost broke and must now expend its last possible
resource to stay alive; and gone almost broke by self-admitted amateurs
making fast decisions based on utterly inane fast-talk.
You set on going for broke too? Lemmings ain't in it.
Phil Innes
quote:
> Since Bill Goichberg is so enamored of this property, I urge him to
> buy it himself to house his own Continental Chess Association. Then he
> can develop the property along the lines he proposes.
>
> Perhaps Larry Parr can become an investor, along with Bill Goichberg,
> in this classic money pit.
>
> Tim Hanke
> USCF Vice President of Finance
| |
| Sam Sloan 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 22:30:10 GMT, "Tim Hanke"
<timothyhanke@comcast.net> wrote:
quote:
>Because we don't need cash to construct our new building in Crossville, we
>have given the proceeds of the New Windsor building sale to USCF's LMA
>Committee to manage.
That was mighty White of you, since the LMA already owned the
building.
Sam Sloan
| |
| Parrthenon 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| <<Virtually all preWW2 buildings used asbestos as an insulator and these
buildings are a monetary time bomb for any non-profit dumb enough to take over
title. This proposed gift horse, likely has typhoid.>> -- Richard Peterson
Instead of speculation, shouldn't these issues be checked out before rejecting
a bid? What is wrong with waiting two weeks in order to see if there's a
problem. If there is, perhaps the Gerry Foundation will fix it.
I have an open mind but see no compelling reason for rushing to judgment
without having more facts about such a compelling issue that affects the
direction of American chess.
Meanwhile we still await the reasons why Beatriz Marinello is so adamant about
favoring Crossville over other sites. I'm willing to be persuaded and so are
many others on this forum.
Let's hear the case for Crossville and the case against Liberty. Let's hear
about the flaws in Goichberg's relocation report.
So far the silence is deafening.
________________________________________________________________
"FIDE has made its decision. Players who refuse to be drug tested will not be
able to play chess." -- Dr. Press, co-founder of the FIDE Medical Commission.
| |
| Sam Sloan 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| On 22 Oct 2004 12:34:47 -0700, larry_tapper@yahoo.com (Larry Tapper)
wrote:
[vbcol=seagreen]
>LD> Crossville is an option in which the financial costs can be
>estimated with a
>much smaller range of error (dollar wise) than the Liberty bid. It is
>a safer
>bet when you cannot afford to make another major financial
>miscalculation.
>
>This strikes me as one of several good arguments made by Dr. Dubeck,
>and I'm sorry to see that his post has been greeted with silence so
>far. (Following rgcp tradition, I suppose I should say "deafening
>silence".) In particular I'd like to see what Bill Goichberg has to
>say in response to Dr. Dubeck, because often BG is a paragon of
>point-for-point responsiveness.
>
>I live in the mountains of western Carolina, about a three-hour drive
>from Crossville. Before that I lived for many years in Boston and
>spent a lot of time in NYC, so I can understand the creepy feeling
>chessplaying cosmopolites may get when they contemplate a move to what
>seems to them like the remote boondocks. But I can't help feeling that
>they're seriously overestimating the potential horror of it, and that
>this is affecting their judgment. Of the posts that I've seen on this
>subject, Dr. Dubeck's strikes me as the most sensible --- sure,
>Crossville could always turn out to be a mistake, but as USCF mistakes
>go, this one would turn out to be relatively minor and controllable.
>
>Larry Tapper
>USCF member since 1962
>
>
>
>lwdubeck@aol.com (LWDubeck) wrote in message news:<20041020233249.05436.00001628@mb-m20.aol.com>...
However, I think Dubeck greatly underestimates the financial risks
involved in moving to Crossville. For one, they will be building a
building at a minimum cost of $360,000 but the actual cost will
probably be more than $500,000.
A few years from now, when they want to sell it, who will buy it? They
might get no more than $50,000 for it, and take a 90% loss.
It took them over a year to sell the building in New Windsor which had
more than 15,000 square feet in it, or four times the size of the
projected Crossville building.
Sam Sloan
| |
| Mike Nolan 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| "StanB" <stanbooz@comXXXcast.net> writes:
quote:
>"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
>news:41798958.44241171@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
[vbcol=seagreen]
>I believe for every word that Sam writes a bull relieves.
According to the floor plan, the interior dimensions for first floor of
the old building were 47'8" wide and 119' long, which is 5672 square feet.
In early 2003 there were around 35 employees working in that space.
I don't have dimensions for the space they're currently using, but I was
told in early 2003 that the space they were renting at that time
was between 3000 and 3500 square feet. I don't know how much additional
space they rented this summer, but I doubt that it is more than 1000
square feet.
--
Mike Nolan
| |
| StanB 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
|
"Parrthenon" <parrthenon@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20041020102542.29586.00002409@mb-m02.news.cs.com...
quote:
> Not included in the Goichberg report is the Erik Anderson AF4C
> intervention
> which, given a few extra weeks , would likely make the Liberty proposal
> vastly
> superior; Free rent for five years, likely elimination of any upfront
> money and
> an option to buy after five years.
Why is that likely?
| |
| Angelo DePalma 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
|
"StanB" <stanbooz@comXXXcast.net> wrote
quote:
> How much does it cost to hire data input folks? More or less depending on
> who runs the adding machine.
Not much. But there's a cost associated with lost time. I believe Bill
pegged it at around 1 month for execs, and my guess is it will be more for
underlings simply because wherever we move, we're not there already.
You haven't answered what you'll do about Ken Thomas and others like him,
who currently drive to the office. Bet you 30 lbs of mozzarella you won't
find a chessplaying accountant with his organizational experience and love
for USCF within 90 miles of Crossville. Ditto for Bisguier and whoever else.
Are you going to fly them all down three times a month for $1200 a pop and
put them up in hotels?
quote:
>
> About what/
Everything. This move is unwarranted at this time. It's the WRONG MOVE TO
THE WRONG PLACE AT THE WRONG TIME. Hahahahahahahaaaaaaaa.
quote:
>
>
> I thought you said you were right?
That's what I read. Hence "I thought" and not "it was".
quote:
> We have been renting for a while. We have three or four times the
> employees you cite.
I was told many of the workers telecommute. Still, my house is 2800 square
feet and could easily fit 20-30 people. EASILY. Three people per room.
C'mon.
quote:
>
> It's the morgue and it is chuck full of old periodicals concerning chess.
> Over the years the best stuff has disappeared.
Throw the shit out or auction it.
quote:
> You ever wonder why Bill and the Old Guard asked AF4C to support that
> gothic mansion notion and not Tennessee or Kansas?
Of course. It's close to Salisbury Mills. It's also close to Hackettstown
and wherever else the other day-trippers or overnighters come from. No
ulterior motive or ethics problem there.
adp
| |
| Recmate 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
| >Subject: Re: Goichberg's Relocation Report
quote:
>From: chessforlife@aol.com (ChessforLife)
>Date: 10/20/2004 11:30 AM Eastern Daylight Time
>Message-id: <20041020113023.29613.00001048@mb-m05.aol.com>
>
>"
> ONE MORE THING
>
>Not included in the Goichberg report is the Erik Anderson AF4C intervention
>which, given a few extra weeks , would likely make the Liberty proposal
>vastly
>superior; Free rent for five years, likely elimination of any upfront money
>and
>an option to buy after five years.
>
>One wonders if the executive board took all this into consideration before
>delaying their vote for a few weeks?"
>
>ONE MORE THING
>
>Include in the Bill Goichberg's reports his idea of selling spots in the
>Executive Board to the AFFC.
>Some people do anything for retaining control over the organization, even
>selling seats on the EB.
Beatriz,
The idea of allowing minority representation on the EB to wealthy business
people who would make a mandatory annual donation is not mine. The USCF Past
Presidents committee endorsed discussing such an idea with AF4C, and I think it
is a good idea. However, this idea was in no way associated with Erik
Anderson's offer to try to get us a minimum of five years free rent in Liberty.
For example, let's say that two AF4C people agreed to each donate $50,000 per
year to USCF, and in return the EB appointed them to four year Board terms.
That's $400,000 income for USCF, and two votes out of nine would hardly give
AF4C "control" over USCF.
As a bonus, the AF4C appointees, who have been fabulously successful in the
business world, would be well qualified to contribute towards the making of
wise business decisions by USCF. Since they understand business, they would be
likely to carefully consider the upside and downside of possible courses of
action.
When AF4C offered to take over the US Championship a few years ago, the
Executive Board of that time was suspicious of their motives and almost killed
the deal. The result, however, was 1) USCF has saved $100,000 per year since
then, the amount we were spending on the Championship, and 2) The Championship
has been greatly improved, with a prize fund 2.5 times the size it used to be.
With such a great track record, I would think the Board could have waited two
weeks to see what Erik Anderson of AF4C could come up with on behalf of USCF by
talking with billionaire Alan Gerry. Instead, a Board majority chose to in
effect tell Erik Anderson, "Sorry, we don't want to hear what you have to
offer."
Bill Goichberg
quote:
>I can tell you two thing, I will finish my term as President and make sure
>that
>the move takes place.
>
>Yours for Chess,
>
>Beatriz Marinello
>USCF President
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
| |
| StanB 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
|
"Parrthenon" <parrthenon@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20041020164018.04530.00002604@mb-m02.news.cs.com...
quote:
> I have an open mind but see no compelling reason for rushing to judgment
> without having more facts about such a compelling issue that affects the
> direction of American chess.
Rush? This has been dragging on for two years now. Why couldn't those
subsqent offers have been made long before now? Why must we shuffle around
awaiting "maybe" support from AF4C, "possible" donations from the donor, EPA
tests and so forth that would surely drag on till next summer and a new
board with new ideas.
quote:
> Meanwhile we still await the reasons why Beatriz Marinello is so adamant
> about
> favoring Crossville over other sites. I'm willing to be persuaded and so
> are
> many others on this forum.
Maybe she didn't like the idea of steam radiators, septic tanks, and 90
minute commutes for the present staff.
| |
| LWDubeck 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| As another member of the Relocation Committee (which included the Co-Chairs of
the Finance Committee and the Chair of the Life Members Assets Committee as
well as the 7 Executive board members), I shared grave reservations about the
Liberty bid similar to those already memtioned. Among my concerns were:
1. The Liberty Building had 30,000 square feet (including the basement)--USCF
needs only 5,000 to 6,000 square feet. Liberty is far too large for us.
2. The buliding was bulit over 100 years ago, and "renovated" in 1951. The
cost of medernizing it will be large and very difficult to estimate. By
comparison the cost of a building with which I am very familiar, that was built
in the early 1960's, is on the order of 10 MILLION dollars for a building
several times as large as the proposed Liberty building. Mr. Goichberg's
estimate on the costs to make the buliding usable coud be as much as $1 MILLION
dollars off-- leading to the bamkruptcy of the USCF. The excellent detailed
report by Steve Shutt only confirmed my fears that extensive, expensive repairs
would have to be done. As others have noted, asbestos very likely was used as
insulation and its rermoval costs would be huge.
The heating of the buildoing is by oil whose costs seem to be going in only one
direction-- and that is not down. It apparently is not connected to to the
town's gas supply so one can't switch to natural gas.
Upkeep on of the hiuge grounds has to me large. Who clears a 200 yard driveway
to the public road when it snows?
As for entering a rental market--that is not USCF's business. We must focus on
our core business and do that better. The core business is not real estate.
Each time we have ventured into so called "lucrative" business opportunities in
recent years, such as enlarging our books and euipment sales, the results have
brought USCF to the brink of bankruptcy.
Crossville is an option in which the financial costs can be estimated with a
much smaller range of error (dollar wise) than the Liberty bid. It is a safer
bet when you cannot affford to make another major financial miscalculation.
As to the claim that with Liberty nearly all of our employees would relocate,
the driving time from our present location is more than an hour in good
weather. In heavy snow--most employees would be sleeping in the offices or
would have to relocate anyway.
In Crossville we get free land, no down payment needed to construct the
building, free rent for one year while the building is built, a much lower cost
of living (and salaries) than in our current location, tremendous support from
the community, etc. We have been considering Crossville for two years or so and
the decision is hardly hasty. Furthermore one could argue that a prior board
had already made the decision to move to Crossville! Let's get on with the
move. Dr. Leroy Dubeck
rec/game/chess/politics
| |
| The Masked Bishop 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| They all sound like shitholes to me. Middle-of-nowhere.
Rent some office space in New Jersey and be done with it.
quote:
> Liberty is 47 miles from the nearest major
> airport, Crossville 71 miles. Of metro areas of 2,000,000 and up, Liberty
is
quote:
> 106 miles from New York, 188 miles from Philadelphia, 250 miles from
Boston,
quote:
> 285 miles from Baltimore and 324 miles from Washington, while Crossville
is 240
quote:
> miles from Atlanta. Crossville is, however, also 113 miles from
Nashville, 234
quote:
> miles from Louisville, and 313 miles from Charlotte, the latter three
being
quote:
> metro areas of about 1,000,000 to 1,500,000.
>
> Lindsborg is 20 miles from Salina, but Salina Airport appears to have
flights
quote:
> only from Kansas City, and not many. Wichita Airport is 70 miles away,
and it
quote:
> is 194 miles to Kansas City, MO.
>
..
| |
| StanB 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:4177c5ab.12372250@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
>
> That was mighty White of you, since the LMA already owned the
> building.
They also hold loans to Ops that haven't been repaid even though Ops is
awash in cash.
| |
| StanB 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:41798958.44241171@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
> The new proposed building will have 4,000 square feet. I believe that
> the building they just sold in New Windsor for $513,000 had 15,000
> square feet on each of two floors. This is just an estimate. I would
> like for you to supply the exact figure since you probably know.
I believe for every word that Sam writes a bull relieves.
| |
| Sam Sloan 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| On 22 Oct 2004 21:59:17 GMT, gperks2@aol.comnojunk (GrantPerks) wrote:
quote:
>Sam Sloan opins:
>
>Why will "they" want to sell it in a few years?
>
>Grant Perks
The new proposed building will have 4,000 square feet. I believe that
the building they just sold in New Windsor for $513,000 had 15,000
square feet on each of two floors. This is just an estimate. I would
like for you to supply the exact figure since you probably know.
The temporary building they are in now is about 6000 square feet I
think. Kindly provide the correct number.
To pay $360,000 to build a 4,000 square foot building is an amazingly,
unbelieveably bad deal. I can build a building right here in New York
City for a lot cheaper that. Don't believe me? Come here to Far
Rockaway Queens and I will show you new buildings much bigger and
cheaper than that. There are a new dozen buildings under construction
I can see now right outside my window. Most of the construction
workers here are from Bangladesh.
The Crossville deal is such a bad deal that the only real conclusion
is that it is a crime meriting actual jail time.
Also, remember that the Crossville deal was not an arms length
transaction. It is Harold Sabine's deal. Sabine is a former USCF
Policy Board member and a former candidate for USCF President who was
able to use his political influence to push this extermely bad deal
through.
Funny that they accuse me of being the "old guard" when I have never
been even remotely a USCF insider, whereas Harold Sabine is the actual
old guard.
Sam Sloan
| |
| StanB 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
|
"Angelo DePalma" <adpspammersgotohell@tellurian.net> wrote in message
news:17ydnTXgS_v8veTcRVn-jA@garden.net...
quote:
> Not much. But there's a cost associated with lost time. I believe Bill
> pegged it at around 1 month for execs, and my guess is it will be more for
> underlings simply because wherever we move, we're not there already.
What would Billy G. know about it? Has he ever moved his office? How many
people work in the CCA office? I've seen it several times and the down time
is a week at worst. Any more and the boss should be fired.
quote:
> You haven't answered what you'll do about Ken Thomas and others like him,
Me? Nothing. I've got nothing to do with it.
quote:
> who currently drive to the office.
Ken commutes? I thought he stayed there when he was in town.
quote:
> Bet you 30 lbs of mozzarella you won't find a chessplaying accountant with
> his organizational experience and love for USCF within 90 miles of
> Crossville.
Accountants are a fungible commodity. And who cares if they play chess. I'm
not aware that any of our auditors play chess.
quote:
> Ditto for Bisguier and whoever else. Are you going to fly them all down
> three times a month for $1200 a pop and put them up in hotels?
Yea, Art is a nice guy but I doubt that without him the organization is
doomed.
quote:
> Everything. This move is unwarranted at this time. It's the WRONG MOVE TO
> THE WRONG PLACE AT THE WRONG TIME. Hahahahahahahaaaaaaaa.
Shades of Hanoi John. Where would we be without you and Sam Sloan?
quote:
> I was told many of the workers telecommute. Still, my house is 2800 square
> feet and could easily fit 20-30 people. EASILY. Three people per room.
> C'mon.
Okay you, Bill, and Sam can share a room.
quote:
>
> Of course. It's close to Salisbury Mills. It's also close to Hackettstown
> and wherever else the other day-trippers or overnighters come from. No
> ulterior motive or ethics problem there.
Looka ata da bright side pasta breath. Sam is in NY and not in Tennessee.
| |
| Sam Sloan 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| On 22 Oct 2004 23:39:57 GMT, gperks2@aol.comnojunk (GrantPerks) wrote:
quote:
>
>It has the approval of the delegates and two boards. Who should be locked up?
>
>Grant Perks
In 2002 in Cherry Hill the delegates approved a resolution to move.
The original motion by Doyle was for the USCF to move to Miami. There
were a lot of objections to this so after a long debate we passed a
motion that the USCF could move.
Crossville was never mentioned in this motion.
I am not aware of any subsequent motions passed by the delegates. Do
you know of any?
It was just on this past Sunday night that a motion was passed that
the USCF was going to build a 4,000 square foot building in
Crossville, Tennessee for $360,000. Do you realize how small a 4,000
square foot building is? It is the size of a matchbook. I just walked
around my neighborhood looking for a 4,000 square foot building. The
smallest I could find was 6,000 feet. It was so small that I could not
imagine that somebody is living inside of there. Remember that a
building must have a boiler for heat and hot water, an electric meter,
a toilet and so on. The USCF now has 26 employees. Even if you cut the
staff in half, they could not fit into 4,000 square feet.
The plan for the USCF to spend $360,000 to build a 4,000 square foot
building in Crossville Tennessee is such a bad deal that no reasonable
person could possibly agree to it.
Sam Sloan
| |
| Kenneth Sloan 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| larry_tapper@yahoo.com (Larry Tapper) writes:
quote:
> LD> Crossville is an option in which the financial costs can be
> estimated with a
> much smaller range of error (dollar wise) than the Liberty bid. It is
> a safer
> bet when you cannot afford to make another major financial
> miscalculation.
>
> This strikes me as one of several good arguments made by Dr. Dubeck,
> and I'm sorry to see that his post has been greeted with silence so
> far.
Intelligent posts are often greeted by silence. Silly posts always
generate immediate responses.
--
Kenneth Sloan sloan@uab.edu
Computer and Information Sciences (205) 934-2213
University of Alabama at Birmingham FAX (205) 934-5473
Birmingham, AL 35294-1170 http://www.cis.uab.edu/sloan/
| |
| Larry Tapper 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| LD> Crossville is an option in which the financial costs can be
estimated with a
much smaller range of error (dollar wise) than the Liberty bid. It is
a safer
bet when you cannot afford to make another major financial
miscalculation.
This strikes me as one of several good arguments made by Dr. Dubeck,
and I'm sorry to see that his post has been greeted with silence so
far. (Following rgcp tradition, I suppose I should say "deafening
silence".) In particular I'd like to see what Bill Goichberg has to
say in response to Dr. Dubeck, because often BG is a paragon of
point-for-point responsiveness.
I live in the mountains of western Carolina, about a three-hour drive
from Crossville. Before that I lived for many years in Boston and
spent a lot of time in NYC, so I can understand the creepy feeling
chessplaying cosmopolites may get when they contemplate a move to what
seems to them like the remote boondocks. But I can't help feeling that
they're seriously overestimating the potential horror of it, and that
this is affecting their judgment. Of the posts that I've seen on this
subject, Dr. Dubeck's strikes me as the most sensible --- sure,
Crossville could always turn out to be a mistake, but as USCF mistakes
go, this one would turn out to be relatively minor and controllable.
Larry Tapper
USCF member since 1962
lwdubeck@aol.com (LWDubeck) wrote in message news:<20041020233249.05436.00001628@mb-m20.aol.com>...
quote:
> As another member of the Relocation Committee (which included the Co-Chairs of
> the Finance Committee and the Chair of the Life Members Assets Committee as
> well as the 7 Executive board members), I shared grave reservations about the
> Liberty bid similar to those already memtioned. Among my concerns were:
>
> 1. The Liberty Building had 30,000 square feet (including the basement)--USCF
> needs only 5,000 to 6,000 square feet. Liberty is far too large for us.
>
> 2. The buliding was bulit over 100 years ago, and "renovated" in 1951. The
> cost of medernizing it will be large and very difficult to estimate. By
> comparison the cost of a building with which I am very familiar, that was built
> in the early 1960's, is on the order of 10 MILLION dollars for a building
> several times as large as the proposed Liberty building. Mr. Goichberg's
> estimate on the costs to make the buliding usable coud be as much as $1 MILLION
> dollars off-- leading to the bamkruptcy of the USCF. The excellent detailed
> report by Steve Shutt only confirmed my fears that extensive, expensive repairs
> would have to be done. As others have noted, asbestos very likely was used as
> insulation and its rermoval costs would be huge.
>
> The heating of the buildoing is by oil whose costs seem to be going in only one
> direction-- and that is not down. It apparently is not connected to to the
> town's gas supply so one can't switch to natural gas.
>
> Upkeep on of the hiuge grounds has to me large. Who clears a 200 yard driveway
> to the public road when it snows?
>
> As for entering a rental market--that is not USCF's business. We must focus on
> our core business and do that better. The core business is not real estate.
> Each time we have ventured into so called "lucrative" business opportunities in
> recent years, such as enlarging our books and euipment sales, the results have
> brought USCF to the brink of bankruptcy.
>
> Crossville is an option in which the financial costs can be estimated with a
> much smaller range of error (dollar wise) than the Liberty bid. It is a safer
> bet when you cannot affford to make another major financial miscalculation.
>
> As to the claim that with Liberty nearly all of our employees would relocate,
> the driving time from our present location is more than an hour in good
> weather. In heavy snow--most employees would be sleeping in the offices or
> would have to relocate anyway.
>
> In Crossville we get free land, no down payment needed to construct the
> building, free rent for one year while the building is built, a much lower cost
> of living (and salaries) than in our current location, tremendous support from
> the community, etc. We have been considering Crossville for two years or so and
> the decision is hardly hasty. Furthermore one could argue that a prior board
> had already made the decision to move to Crossville! Let's get on with the
> move. Dr. Leroy Dubeck
> rec/game/chess/politics
| |
| GrantPerks 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| Sam Sloan answered:
quote:
>The new proposed building will have 4,000 square feet. I believe that
>the building they just sold in New Windsor for $513,000 had 15,000
>square feet on each of two floors. This is just an estimate. I would
>like for you to supply the exact figure since you probably know.
Why should I answer your question when you didn't answer mine? But, as I
recall, the building in New Windsor was 9,000sqft on each floor.
quote:
>
>The temporary building they are in now is about 6000 square feet I
>think. Kindly provide the correct number.
I don't think I ever knew the answer, but 6000 sqft sounds about right.
quote:
>To pay $360,000 to build a 4,000 square foot building is an amazingly,
>unbelieveably bad deal.<snipped the rambling about cheap imigrant labor>
Sounds about right for around here. Residential is about $100 sqft in Ohio, I
assume commercial should be less.
quote:
>The Crossville deal is such a bad deal that the only real conclusion
>is that it is a crime meriting actual jail time.
It has the approval of the delegates and two boards. Who should be locked up?
Grant Perks
| |
| GrantPerks 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| Sam Sloan opins:
quote:
>A few years from now, when they want to sell it, who will buy it? They
>might get no more than $50,000 for it, and take a 90% loss.
>
Why will "they" want to sell it in a few years?
Grant Perks
| |
| StanB 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
|
"Angelo DePalma" <adpspammersgotohell@tellurian.net> wrote in message
news:nIudnSSmBp2zGuXcRVn-oA@garden.net...
quote:
>
> 1. So the move is costing a small fortune, and they don't even include
> moving expenses, lost productivity and the cost of hiring new people. Do
> Bill's numbers add up to around $700,000? How much money do we have?
How much does it cost to hire data input folks? More or less depending on
who runs the adding machine.
quote:
> 2. I was right, Stan.
About what/
quote:
> 3. I thought the building in Crossville was free.
I thought you said you were right?
quote:
> 4. Most struggling organizations don't go out and buy a building, they
> rent for a while. Seems that we could get a suite or storefront somewhere
> in Putnam, Dutchess, or even northern Westchester county for about $2000 a
> month and let someone else pay for tile, carpeting, and all that stuff. We
> don't need 6,000 square feet, not with 8 employees.
We have been renting for a while. We have three or four times the employees
you cite.
quote:
> 5. What on earth is "our library" and what do we need to store? Data? We
> carry no inventory. Paper records? Old magazines? Rent a goddamned box
> somewhere.
It's the morgue and it is chuck full of old periodicals concerning chess.
Over the years the best stuff has disappeared.
You ever wonder why Bill and the Old Guard asked AF4C to support that gothic
mansion notion and not Tennessee or Kansas?
| |
| Chessdon 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| >Sam Sloan answered:
quote:
>
I believe it isabout 6,000 sq feet per floor
quote:
>Why should I answer your question when you didn't answer mine? But, as I
>recall, the building in New Windsor was 9,000sqft on each floor.
>
>
>
No much less but they (I think) still have storage space in the old building.
quote:
> I think the right answer is closer to 5,000 sq ft
quote:
>I don't think I ever knew the answer, but 6000 sqft sounds about right.
>
see above where i said 5000 sq ft.
quote:
>
>Sounds about right for around here. Residential is about $100 sqft in Ohio, I
>assume commercial should be less.
>
>
>
>It has the approval of the delegates and two boards. Who should be locked up?
>
>Grant Perks
| |
| GrantPerks 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| Stan Booz wrote:
quote:
>What would Billy G. know about it? Has he ever moved his office? How many
>people work in the CCA office? I've seen it several times and the down time
>is a week at worst. Any more and the boss should be fired.
What about the down time prior to the move? Have the current employees been
offered bonus to stay on until the move?
I hear there might be a domino effect in at least one of the departments prior
to the move.
quote:
>
>Accountants are a fungible commodity. And who cares if they play chess. I'm
>not aware that any of our auditors play chess.
There are probably more accountants with fungi in Tennessee than those who play
chess.
[vbcol=seagreen]
>
Doesn't former assistant editor IM Burnett now live in Tennessee?
Grant Perks
| |
| Sam Sloan 2004-10-28, 6:45 am |
| Stan is nit-picking because my point is that Beatriz excludes Bill
Goichberg from receiving any credit for the financial turnaround of
the USCF.
Apparently, Stan agrees with me on that point.
Sam Sloan
On Sat, 23 Oct 2004 14:09:41 -0400, "StanB" <stanbooz@comXXXcast.net>
wrote:
[vbcol=seagreen]
>Clearly the word "all" is not in her statement. You may be the only person
>on this group that didn't know that she did this in concert with Don, Tim,
>and the finance chair.
>
>
>"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
>news:417a87d1.22946015@ca.news.verio.net...
| |
| Mike Nolan 2004-10-28, 6:45 am |
| sloan@ishipress.com (Sam Sloan) writes:
quote:
>Stan is nit-picking because my point is that Beatriz excludes Bill
>Goichberg from receiving any credit for the financial turnaround of
>the USCF.
quote:
>Apparently, Stan agrees with me on that point.
You aren't reading the same posts from Stan that the rest of us are.
It was a YEAR-LONG effort. The layoffs in August were one major step,
but certainly not the only one. Grant and Bill deserve a share of the
credit, as do quite a few others.
--
Mike Nolan
| |
|
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:417ad301.42194031@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
> Stan is nit-picking because my point is that Beatriz excludes Bill
> Goichberg from receiving any credit for the financial turnaround of
> the USCF.
>
> Apparently, Stan agrees with me on that point.
And rightly so.
| |
|
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:417a1712.80522968@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
>I have just received an e-mail from an authoritative source (who asks
> that his or her name not be mentioned) that the old building which was
> just sold for $513,000 had 9,000 square feet on each of two floors,
> for a total of 18,000 square feet in all.
Clearly, that is unimpeachable proof. See Mike Nolan's lies about the actual
office size. Thanks for you invaluable contribution. Is Peter Leko still
dead?
| |
|
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:9802e06e.0410230019.33c476dc@posting.google.com...
quote:
> Clearly, when she advises him to run for Executive Board, she is
> also calling upon him to resign, because it is well established that
> an employee cannot run for Executive Board.
Clearly, you are an idiot and you think everyone else must be an idiot too.
quote:
> Right now, there are many who feel that Beatriz Marinello should
> resign.
Clearly, you don't think an Hispanic, and a women at that, should be on the
board much less president of said board. It's bigots like you that have
shamed our great country for the past 225 years.
| |
|
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:417a7bf6.19911281@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
>
> Exactly the point. Your office is in an office building where the
> common utilities such as heat and hot water boilers and electric
> meters are located in a room for use by all the tenants in the
> building.
No it is not. I own units 39 and 40 of the Bailiwick Office complex located
in Doylestown. I opened the common wall so that they may serve as one large
suite of offices. That is why I have two heaters.
quote:
> By contrast, the Beatriz plan calls for a new building owned and
> occupied solely by the USCF. 4,000 square feet may be sufficient for
> your office and your office staff in a much larger building but it is
> not suffient for an entire building. Also, where will the employees
> eat? Are there restaurants nearby? Will there be a lunch room as there
> was in the New Windsor office?
Why do you assume I'm in an office building? At the local restaurants, fast
food establishments, and brown bags.
quote:
> You are obviously correct.
Here we reach common agreement.
quote:
> When the plans finally get to the drawing
> board stage, the building will increase to 5,000 square feet. That
> means that the cost will increase to $450,000. Then, we will have sold
> for $513,000 a building with 18,000 square feet and near to a city
> center in order to build a building of 5,000 square feet out in a
> remote rural area for $450,000. Does that make any sense at all, or is
> that completely crazy and stupid?
First off it is nowhere near 18,000 sq ft. Second, it will be brand spanking
new and have adequate parking. Third, the area will be no less rural then
the present location. A virtual metropolis compared to Liberty. A wise
investment if you ask me.
| |
| Mike Nolan 2004-10-29, 5:46 pm |
| sloan@ishipress.com (Sam Sloan) writes:
quote:
>My source now corrects me saying that it is 12,000 sq ft. 6,000
>upstairs and 6,000 downstairs.
Sam, you gotta turn the monitor right side up!
Those are the outside dimensions of the building as it was advertised
for sale.
BTW, Judy tells me that even with the additional space they rented, she
thinks they have less than 3500 square feet today.
I think 4000 square feet is a reasonable target, but I suspect the final
plans will need to be a bit larger than that. Publications has a lot
of backfile material, if it's worth keeping it may require additional
storage space beyond that contemplated in coming up with 4K square feet.
--
Mike Nolan
| |
|
| Clearly the word "all" is not in her statement. You may be the only person
on this group that didn't know that she did this in concert with Don, Tim,
and the finance chair.
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:417a87d1.22946015@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
>I have been asked to provided an example where Beatriz wrote that all
> of the credit for the financial recovery of the USCF belongs to her
> and none of it belongs to Bill Goichberg.
>
> Here is one instance where she says that. She writes that the
> financial recovery was brought about by laying off staff, which is
> something Beatriz did, Goichberg did not become Executive Director
> until two months later, and by outsourcing Books and Equipment, which
> is something Goiichberg opposed although he did eventually negotiate a
> much better deal with Chess Cafe.
>
> Sam Sloan
>
> On 21 Oct 2004 01:48:10 GMT, chessforlife@aol.com (ChessforLife)
> wrote:
>
>
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"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> wrote in message
news:417b1900.60112687@ca.news.verio.net...
quote:
>
> My source now corrects me saying that it is 12,000 sq ft. 6,000
> upstairs and 6,000 downstairs.
And I'm always wrong? Please note that the downstairs was an unfinished
basement.
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| Sam Sloan 2004-11-08, 6:45 am |
| On 21 Oct 2004 03:41:11 GMT, chessforlife@aol.com (ChessforLife)
wrote:
quote:
>Bill,
>
>You are a smart person, think about this let's add two paying Executive Board
>members (I am skeptical about the possibility of getting this money for only
>seats in the board, but let's pretend that actually happens) plus moving into a
>building purchased by the AFFC for five years.
>
>What do you make out this situation?
>
>Erik Anderson is a very respectful and successful business person. The USCF
>should be always grateful to him for his contributions to chess. But the USCF
>deserves to have it own building and control over the operations.
>
>This is nothing personal, but you are going to far to secure a position of
>control within the USCF. Do us a favor, run for the Executive Board get
>yourself elected and then you will have a chance to contribute to the policy
>making process.
>
>The decision has been made. This is the end of it!
>
>Beatriz Marinello
>USCF President
>
>"At a teleconference on Sunday evening Oct 17, 2004 the USCF Executive Board
>voted to move to Crossville, Tennessee by March 31, 2005. Here are the relevant
>two motions:
>
>EB 05-14 (Brady and Schultz): Considering the AF4C Foundation has requested we
>delay our decision for two weeks and that AF4C has demonstrated good faith in
>the past by relieving USCF of the burden of our having to fund an annual US
>championship thus saving us a hundred plus thousand dollars annually, that when
>we failed to merge with AF4C we told them we still wanted to find ways to work
>with them, and that AF4C has stated they will know in two weeks whether they
>will buy the Liberty, NY building and as a result offer us free office space
>for five years with an option to buy at the end of that period, considering all
>this, we delay our relocation decision for two weeks. FAILED 3-4 In favor:
>Bauer, Brady and Schultz; Opposed: Marinello, Hanke. Shutt and Shaughnessy"
>
>
>Beatriz,
>
>The idea of allowing minority representation on the EB to wealthy business
>people who would make a mandatory annual donation is not mine. The USCF Past
>Presidents committee endorsed discussing such an idea with AF4C, and I think it
>is a good idea. However, this idea was in no way associated with Erik
>Anderson's offer to try to get us a minimum of five years free rent in Liberty.
>
>For example, let's say that two AF4C people agreed to each donate $50,000 per
>year to USCF, and in return the EB appointed them to four year Board terms.
>That's $400,000 income for USCF, and two votes out of nine would hardly give
>AF4C "control" over USCF.
>
>As a bonus, the AF4C appointees, who have been fabulously successful in the
>business world, would be well qualified to contribute towards the making of
>wise business decisions by USCF. Since they understand business, they would be
>likely to carefully consider the upside and downside of possible courses of
>action.
>
>When AF4C offered to take over the US Championship a few years ago, the
>Executive Board of that time was suspicious of their motives and almost killed
>the deal. The result, however, was 1) USCF has saved $100,000 per year since
>then, the amount we were spending on the Championship, and 2) The Championship
>has been greatly improved, with a prize fund 2.5 times the size it used to be.
>
>With such a great track record, I would think the Board could have waited two
>weeks to see what Erik Anderson of AF4C could come up with on behalf of USCF by
>talking with billionaire Alan Gerry. Instead, a Board majority chose to in
>effect tell Erik Anderson, "Sorry, we don't want to hear what you have to
>offer."
>
>Bill Goichberg
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| Angelo DePalma 2004-11-08, 5:47 pm |
|
"Sam Sloan" <sloan@ishipress.com> quoted chessforlife@aol.com
(ChessforLife):
[vbcol=seagreen]
(snip)
[vbcol=seagreen]
On what basis does USCF "deserve" its own building, to the exclusion of
granting wealthy patrons board seats? Many successful businesses, including
ones that are larger (revenues, employees) than USCF and which are in a
better financial situation, rent office space. Most organizations offered
free rent (if I read Bill G's email correctly) would JUMP at the chance.
I do not understand the fetish of needing to own a building.
As John Kerry said many times during the campaign, "I'm believin' .....that
movin' to Crossville, Tennessee...and I just LOVE the workin' folks livin'
down there...in Tennessee...is the WRONG move, at the WRONG time, for the
WRONG reasons."
Even John "Breck Girl" Edwards believes as much. "We have....in this
country...two USCFs....one of the hard-working,
sensible....wood-pusher...and the other for those bent....on fulfilling
their fantasies....of living near the Grand Ole Opry. And believe me folks,
I *LUV* country music....as much as Beatriz Marinello....but the move to
Crossville will ..... in my opinion....cost this country jobs....good,
evelope-stuffing jobs...and in the long run Democrat votes. Because
who....but an envelope stuffer with an IQ of 70 or lower....would vote for
me?"
Just yesterday Al Gore chimed in on this important topic: "God knows....mah
home state of Tennessee...needs more envelope-stuffer jobs....but a
study...by the Center for Responsible Avoidance of Environmental
Cataclysms....has determined that....the site of USCF's new building....will
hurt the environment....irreparably. A proverbial buttefly's wing ....
flapping .... bringing tidal waves to every point on earth....followed bah a
new ice age...and a lotta icky bugs."
Finally Dr. why-didn't-we-nominate-him, Howard Dean, weighed in on the
subject. "Moving to Crossville...YEEEEEEEEAHHHHHHHHHH!!!! willl
prevent....those poor black children from getting ..... essential services
like EEEEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHH!!!!! healthcare....and college degrees....plus it
will disenfranchise the poor ...the unworthy...the incorrigible....the
stupid. And after Crossville, what????? EEEHaaaaaaa! they'll move to VEGAS?
and then LIBERTY!!!!! EeeeeeeeeeeeeehAAAAAAAAA liberty for whom? NOT FOR THE
POOR DISENFRANCHISED.....not for the kids.....in need of vaccines or their
CalChess subscription money.
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!"
So you see, the move to Crossville goes against the collective wisdom of
great American thinkers.
adp
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