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Home > Archive > Chess politics > October 2004 > DUMP Kramnik
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| Angelo DePalma 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
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Kramnik has evidently pulled out of the Prague agreement, which he signed
onto only reluctantly. I don't want to say "I told you so" but I did predict
the unification was a fantasy.
Now Krumnutz wants to dictate the terms of his next match. Specifically he
wants Pono, Anand, Kasparov, and Kasim to play a 4-person tournament to
determine his challenger.
None of these guys, with the possible exception of Kasimdzhanov, has any
legitimate claim to a preferred position vis-a-vis the world championship.
1. Kasparov has not played a sanctioned match in a decade; all his opps were
hand-picked. Plus he's been relatively inactive.
2. Kramnik beat Kasparov what...3 years ago? Is he the Russian Bobby
Fischer, who believes he retains his title forever? Is he better than Leko?
Also see point #1.
3. Based on the last 2 years' performance Anand is probably the best player
in the world right now. He has pretty much kept quiet about being left out
of this current cycle. He deserves a spot, but that's how it goes.
It's obvious at this point that you can count on everyone involved in this
sorry world chess scene to act as disgracefully and stupidly as possible.
Kramnik signed on to this deal, now he wants out. Too bad he had draw odds
in his match.
What I fear most from this is that Ilumzhumobobovich will simply declare the
winner of Kasim-Kaspy to be world champion, and we'll be right back where we
were 4 years ago.
What a mess.
adp
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| Hans Jørgen Lassen 2004-10-27, 12:46 am |
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"David Kane" wrote:
quote:
> I'm no particular fan of Kramnik, and of course have
> zero insight into his motives. However, he did refer
> to "corporate sponsors and civilised European
> countries" in his rational. Ultimately anything that
> deligitimizes these dictator showcase events in
> closed repressive countries (FIDE Libya etc.) is a
> step in the right direction.
I noted that point too, but if pursued consequently, there wont be much
left. The US of course is ruled out because of its illegal attack on Iraq,
and so are all its allies, England, Australia, Denmark, Spain and for other
reasons Israel, Russia, Libya (as you mention), and a number of Arab
countries. Germany and France might be possibilities, but thats about it.
Hans J
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| Hans Jørgen Lassen 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| A crazy thought just entered my mind: Is it really necessary to have a world
champion? Why cant those guys (and Polgar) just play chess and give us some
good games?
Hans J
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| David Kane 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
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"Don C. Aldrich" <dondo@mn.rr.com> wrote in message
news:btgin0p0p8vb64n924ofjm6b4aqd0qhm7l@4ax.com...
quote:
> Uh, no. Prague was killed by Pono. You can say Kramnik is using a
> weenie technicality, but remember that Prague was really fragile, and
> the agreement was very specific as to what happened. When Pono
> refused to play, it was dead.
>
> One of the big gripes was that it would take too long, and kept folks
> like Anand out. Now we are way past the deadlines in the agreement,
> and FIDE has still not conducted their side of it.
>
> Now I can see Kaspy saying I ain't playing in no qualifying tmt. But,
> if the ACP organizes it, and Anand takes part, it is going to be very
> credible. And don't forget, Kramnik has NAO money behind him...
>
I'm no particular fan of Kramnik, and of course have
zero insight into his motives. However, he did refer
to "corporate sponsors and civilised European
countries" in his rational. Ultimately anything that
deligitimizes these dictator showcase events in
closed repressive countries (FIDE Libya etc.) is a
step in the right direction.
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| Angelo DePalma 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
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My guess is that Kramnik is going where the money is, or where he believes
it will be. At this point I don't believe anyone's "professional" or
"ethical" motives because as far as I can see top chess players have none.
If a sponsor came forward guaranteeing him $2 million for playing the winner
of Kasim-Kaspy, and if FIDE promised him another big payday 2-3 years hence
in a title defense, I'm sure he'd play.
The question are:
How does ACP plan to finance their ambitious hijacking of the Prague
agreement?
Is the world -- and are top chessplayers -- not tired of the current
fragmented, disjointed title system?
How many of them will play along with ACP?
Can any of the 3 current participants really lay claim to anything
resembling a true world championship title *without* reuinification?
Kramnik-Leko was a WC only in name. I believe that FIDE recognized this
latest match as a WC only for purposes of reuinification. Now that Krum-nutz
has apparently pulled out it should revoke its peculiar designation of Kram
as WC and get on with it.
adp
"Hans Jørgen Lassen" <hj.lassen@privat.dk> wrote in message
news:4178b1b1$0$251$edfadb0f@dread12.news.tele.dk...
quote:
>
> "Angelo DePalma" wrote:
>
>
> One has to agree with that very precise statement. It took some effort to
> get there, but many contributed. I just want to emphasize two points:
>
> 1. Kramnik plays very fine chess, when he is in the mood. He succeeded in
> rehabilitating the Berlin Defense, he beat Kasparov (I for one never did)
> and those last two games (well, out of 14) against Leko were really
> impressive, demonstrating both skill and a will to fight.
>
> 2. The FIDE championships are worth nothing for a number of reasons that
> are too evident even to state.
>
> Hans J
>
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| bia34 2004-10-28, 12:46 am |
| Fide always had problems, even back to time of Bobby fisher, and it will
continue to have problems, it never stop to have problems, too much conflict
of interest. Should eliminate high speed, cheap knockout tournament. Chess
championship road is a long fight, not wimbledon tennis knockout. Winning
one knockout tournament definately not enough credential to claim as world
champion.
"Isidor Gunsberg" <gunsberg@kasparovchess.com> wrote in message
news:ce29ddd3.0410221206.1ed793d0@posting.google.com...
quote:
> "Angelo DePalma" <adpspammersgotohell@tellurian.net> wrote in message
news:<CsCdnbv7CvTvg-TcRVn-vw@garden.net>...[vbcol=seagreen]
believes[vbcol=seagreen]
none.[vbcol=seagreen]
winner[vbcol=seagreen]
hence[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> This is probably true. It is probably also the case that Kramnik has
> withstood the challenge of his most dangerous rival, Peter Leko.
>
> Kramnik claims that he is not bound to play a Unification match
> versus the winner of FIDE's Kasimzhanov--Kasparov match. On a
> technical basis, he does have a point, since the Unification plan tha
> Kramnik signed **Specified** that he would play the winner of a match
> between Kasparov and Ponomariov. He's probably just fed up with
> dealing with FIDE. Remember that the WC Title which Kasimzhanov won
> was tainted by the fact that the FIDE WC KO tournament was played in
> Libya.
>
> Sure, I'd like to see him play the winner of the
> Kasimzhanov--Kasparov match. But with FIDE, it is an open question as
> to whether the match will actually take place.
>
> Certainly, a 4 way candidates tournament between Kasparov, Anand,
> Kasimzhanov, and Ponomariov would produce a strong challenger.
>
> Let's face it: as long as FIDE is run the way it is, there will
> always be chaos, discord, and controversy regarding the World
> Championship...
>
> Delicate negotiations might be within a hair of creating an
> agreement for a meaningful unification match, and then FIDE will run
> another of its lottery World Championships, sponsored by some
> repressive regime, and some guy who is not even ranked in the Top 20
> will get lucky and win...
>
>
Krum-nutz[vbcol=seagreen]
Kram[vbcol=seagreen]
to[vbcol=seagreen]
in[vbcol=seagreen]
did)[vbcol=seagreen]
that[vbcol=seagreen]
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| Graeme 2004-10-28, 9:45 am |
| >A crazy thought just entered my mind: Is it really necessary to have a world
quote:
>champion? Why cant those guys (and Polgar) just play chess and give us some
>good games?
>Hans J
>
>
Sponsors and the public get more interested when there's a world champion.
It's not strictly "necessary", but it's good for the game.
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